Why the SV20 H/C is almost useless (to me anyway)

Discussion in 'Marshall Amps' started by Bergstrom, Feb 17, 2021.

  1. Shane Stevenson

    Shane Stevenson Well-Known Member

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    I don’t like attenuators at all for the same reasons mentioned above, so when I was experiencing your problem I was about to sell my SV rig with sadness. It’s really a great amp. Finally a member here talked me into the Weber Mini Mass 50 and I figured it was a cheap enough one last try. I had to go directly through Weber and it took two weeks. When I received it the decision to keep my amp was clear. It’s usable again. Even better for me is that not all gigs require me to use it or to use it at its weakest setting, just to take a little of the volume level. It’s the most transparent attenuator I’ve had up to this point.
     
  2. JacksonCharvelAddict

    JacksonCharvelAddict Well-Known Member

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    If 5 watts is too loud just get a fucking acoustic already. Damn.
     
  3. JohnH

    JohnH Well-Known Member

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    This is what I had in mind as a super simple fixed but reactive attenuator, based on our workbench design. Combined with the studio amps 20/5 W switch, it will give you two further -6db steps, so you have 20W, 5W, 1.2W and 0.3W. More features from the full design can be added easily.

    M2-12db 200221.gif
     
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  4. Bergstrom

    Bergstrom Member

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    Good Sir, at last a proper reply. A fucking acoustic it will be. And couldn’t agree more with the ’Damn’.
     
  5. donwagar

    donwagar Active Member

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    I've been there, done that, with a one trick pony amp. A 4010, man, I still miss that amp. But. It didn't work for what I need for gigging.

    I really love the SV20, but again, won't work for what I need in an amp. So I saved some $ and bought a DSL40CR. Works great for what I need in the band. With the 6 button footswitch, perfect.

    Someday, maybe I'll be playing in a band that I can use an SV20. I still want one.

    Bottom line, get the amp that fits your situation.
     
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2021
  6. Chris-in-LA

    Chris-in-LA Well-Known Member

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    Where would I find those air coils?
     
  7. JohnH

    JohnH Well-Known Member

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    These are generally found wherever cross-over parts for speakers are sold. In the US, Madisound is a good source, they do a range in 19 gauge which is fine in place of 18.

    19 AWG Madisound Air Core Inductors: Madisound Speaker Components (madisoundspeakerstore.com)
    0.85mH is Ok instead of 0.9mH

    if you want to know more, this is the full thread:
    Simple Attenuators - Design And Testing | MarshallForum.com

    Post 1 has all the basics, then take a look at the latest builds in the recent pages.
     
  8. Kim Lucky Day

    Kim Lucky Day Well-Known Member Gold Supporting Member

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    I gig with an SV20H played through a 2061cx (loaded with one blackback and one greenback). I run a Weber Mini Mass. I also use the JHS Little Black Box in the loop after a SoloDallas Storm, which I use for a volume boost for solos. I run the amp exclusively on 20W mode to keep max headroom. The JHS LBB I run at about 75%. Tone may be subjective but I absolutely love my tone. So I need an attenuator. So I don't have an ultra-tidy setup. Big deal. My setup gives me the tone I'm after at a volume level appropriate for the venue. But what works me isn't for everyone else (or anyone else, for that matter). I've never had the opportunity to do a side by side comparison with a 1959 Super Lead so I can't comment on how authentic the sound is. But I can say that this amp is everything I hoped it would be.
     
  9. pedecamp

    pedecamp Well-Known Member

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    I have a very simple and inexpensive solution for this problem, I have a JHS volume box in the loop to lower volume and an LPB-1 after it for volume lead boost. I play at 20 watt mode plugged into the treble channel and volume dimed.
     
  10. Old Punker

    Old Punker Well-Known Member

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    Hey @Shane Stevenson - I'm curious, why do you favor the SV20 over the SC20? I have the SC20H and I love it, but since so many here keep talking about it, I keep thinking I should also try the SV, when I have some ca$h. I was under the assumption that the SC is mainly a more gainy version of the SV, with a master volume. :scratch:
     
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  11. Shane Stevenson

    Shane Stevenson Well-Known Member

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    First off, I don’t want to appear as if I snapped at the dude a few entries back...that’s not me at all. So
    Anyway, my SC is more grainy and mid scooped than my SV. My SV has a natural organic voice that I just can’t get tired of. I play blues and classic rock with no pedals with my SV. To me the SV just feels better and more like home.

    When I was on the hunt for a studio series Marshall amp, every online vid I watched had the SC sounding better. That’s why I bought it first. Then, like you, my curiosity peeked and I pulled the trigger on the SV. Also, I’m using 2X12 Studio cabs with each of these amps. Look at my profile pic. Every musician I’ve played with also agrees that the SV does me and our music more justice and has a better tone. I even covered a few Merle Haggard songs with the volume rolled back on my SV. I can’t do that on my SC.

    So in a nutshell:

    SC=more bass, grainier treble, less mid thump and less 3D effect.

    SV=less bass but still plenty enough, more 3D effect (reminds me of a my Zwreck kind of) more extremely usable natural mids and all in all..a MUCH smoother amp than my SC.
     
  12. marshallmellowed

    marshallmellowed Well-Known Member

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    There are several ways to get a solo volume boost from non-MV amps, but they all seem to come with a compromise. To me, the best approach would be an attenuator that has 2 levels of attenuation that could be switched by footswitch. Aside from something like the Badcat Unleash, which is actually a re-amping device, I don't know of a good attenuator that has this feature. The Weber's can be ordered with a "Bypass" option, but that's not of much use (IMO), unless you always want your solo volume to be "wide open" (no attenuation). I think the design of the Power Brake is such that, adding a 2nd foot-switchable level of attenuation may be doable. When I get the time, I'm currently looking at experimenting on one of mine to add this functionality. Using this approach, the full signal level from the preamp hitting the power amp would be maintained. As far as compromises, I find the Power Brake to be very transparent.
     
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2021
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  13. Madfinger

    Madfinger Well-Known Member

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    As mentiond try a JHS or Loopi volume box in the loop first it may be all you need for 5w home 20w everywhere else. They cost fuck all.:yesway:
     
  14. WellBurnTheSky

    WellBurnTheSky Well-Known Member

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    That's the way I do it on my live rig, except I use a Source Audio Programmable EQ pedal for lead boost.
    I also built a dual volume box (basically two A25k pots switched via a 3PDT, with each its LED, plus a Klon-style buffer in front) that works equally well, allows me to switch between two preset volumes. I've gigged it a few times, and it did the job perfectly, all for about 15€ in parts and 30mn work.
     
  15. purpleplexi

    purpleplexi Well-Known Member

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    Tone King Iron man has a defeat footswitch.
     
  16. purpleplexi

    purpleplexi Well-Known Member

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    Anyone at Marshall reading this will be thinking ' we gave them the 1959 and they moaned it was too loud. We gave them a 20watt/5watt version and guess what? It's too loud. Fuck is wrong with these people?
     
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  17. Madfinger

    Madfinger Well-Known Member

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    :applause::h5:
     
  18. pedecamp

    pedecamp Well-Known Member

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    I had an SC20H and returned it cuz I didnt like the effects loop, tonally it was pretty spot on to my 2204 so no complaints there, something that hasnt been mentioned is if plugging some humbuckers in they sound great but single coils too thin and shrill, even with my 2204 single coils are a no go. So I got an SV20H to try and I'm glad I did, humbuckers again sound great, single coils not so great but you have 4 inputs and you can jumper the channels and dial in great tones for your single coils now, that is the beauty of these plexi style amps they are extremely versatile and can dial in any guitar, I'm a 4 hole convert now for that reason! :yesway:
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2021
  19. Michael Roe

    Michael Roe Well-Known Member

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    @Begrstrom You are correct in thinking that all the suggestions are work arounds. All of those work arounds will not sound exactly like the amp when ran at normal volume, aka LOUD.
    I have an SV20H and I also own several attenuators, the JHS Black Box, load box, etc............and even the SC20H. I can assure you that NONE of those work arounds or other amps etc will sound like the SV when in full volume mode. Some of the work arounds are better than others but again, all of them will not get you there.
    There is one other solution: This will get you much closer to the original amp sound at full volume but it cost a lot!
    Get a KEMPER and profile your own amp's sound.

    Here is a vid I did but using a DSL20HR comparing the real amp with a Kemper profile. If any of the work around solutions to quiet a loud amp can get that close then it would be a winner, sadly none of them will :(


    Many guys will say just get the SC20, DSL 20 or Mini Jubilee. They are great amps on their own but will leave you wanting more if what you are after is that Marshall 4 holer sound palate. The SC20 can get you one of those tones that the SV20 can do very well. The SC20 can not give you those myriad of other tones that the SV can with it's 2 volumes and jumping capability. In other words the SV can match anything the SC has to offer but the SC can not match all the tones of the SV. The SV is much more versatile.
    Another important point is that when you attenuate the signal your speaker cab is not getting that same volume so the tone is just not going to be the same.
     
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  20. marshallmellowed

    marshallmellowed Well-Known Member

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    Yes, I believe it's like the Weber, full volume when bypassed. Someone needs to make an affordable attenuator with 2 (or more) foot-switchable levels of attenuation. Like I had mentioned, the only device I've seen that has that feature is the Badcat Unleash, but it's a re-amping device, not an attenuator. There may be others out there, but that's the only one I'm familiar with.
     
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