What happens with the Preamp when on Standby?

Discussion in 'Marshall Amps' started by KraftyBob, Jul 29, 2020.

  1. KraftyBob

    KraftyBob Well-Known Member

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    When an amp is on standby is that only for the power tubes due to the voltages, and is the preamp still functional then?

    The reason I ask is I was thinking about recording my DSL40C through my Helix and into my DAW. I run it in 4CM so the DSL preamp signal comes back into the Helix and I don't know why that would be any different than if I was using a Helix preamp model?

    Assuming the above works, I would still hear the amp/speaker when recording so I was wondering if the preamp still sends a signal to the effects loop when the amp is on standby? And if the preamp does work on standby, is it a problem to run the amp that way for about an hour at a time?

    I've read that you shouldn't leave the amp on standby for more than 15 minutes, and other articles that say it won't hurt anything or affect tube life.

    Thanks
     
  2. Maggot Brain

    Maggot Brain Well-Known Member

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    I am almost certain it does not work that way.

    Also leaving the amp on standby wont hurt it or the tubes. Remember tubes used to be used in nearly everything electrical back in the day, tvs, radios ... etc etc... Those were all used for extended periods of times, hours + etc etc and most of the electronics didnt even have "standby".
     
  3. KraftyBob

    KraftyBob Well-Known Member

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    Bummer, but it was worth a shot. I know I can get a load box with a DI, but I have an SM-57 that I've used up to this point so I'll stick with that vs. spending the money. Not a big deal.

    Thanks.
     
  4. Maggot Brain

    Maggot Brain Well-Known Member

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    I feel ya but its fun to get creative with micing, using 2 mics. Mic the cab at varing distances/locations then get a ambient mic somewhere in the room and blend the 2 in the mix... I always prefer this approuch that DI... something about DI sounds very sterile to me.
     
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  5. Matt_Krush

    Matt_Krush Well-Known Member

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    Check schematic.
    Most standby switched cut power between first hulk cap and rectifier, disabling the high DC voltage.
     
  6. Neptical

    Neptical Active Member

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    Absolutely nothing. You have to turn it on so the world knows who's dominating.

    :h5:
     
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2020
  7. william vogel

    william vogel Active Member

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    Leaving an amp on standby is BAD! Use it for about 12 seconds to warm the tubes and then turn it on. Leaving an amp ON is fine, not on Standby though. Use it to swap a speaker cabinet or instrument but don’t leave it on standby for extended periods of time. Shut it off if you really want to save the tubes.
     
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  8. Maggot Brain

    Maggot Brain Well-Known Member

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    Going to have to disagree.

    Read the manuals from Marshall, they usually state to leave the amp in standby for prolong periods or breaks in playing to help preserve tube life.
     
  9. william vogel

    william vogel Active Member

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    It’s an age old discussion and there’s lots of information out there about standby. Guitar amps are really the only devices that have them. I’m a tech and have my opinion. If you like do a little more research and see if your opinion changes.
     
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  10. El Gringo

    El Gringo Well-Known Member

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    I like how you think :headbanger:
     
  11. Gene Ballzz

    Gene Ballzz Well-Known Member

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    @KraftyBob

    The standby on the newest DSL series operates a bit differently than on most other amps. Here's an excerpt from the manual:

    "32. EMULATED OUT

    Emulated line level output for headphones or connection to a mixer. The DSL is equipped with a high quality emulated output using Softube-designed studio cabinet emulation. This ensures that your headphone and output signal from this socket provide the best possible tone for practice or recording.

    Note: Using EMULATED OUT does not omit the need for a speaker load to be connected to the amplifier (Rear Panel Function #33).

    Note: For silent recording via EMULATED OUT set the OUTPUT switch to STB (Front Panel Function #24)."


    Though it does not specifically state this in the manual, we can clearly extrapolate from what they do give us that everything except the power section operates normally in standby mode. This also means that you could unplug the output of your "Helix" from the EFFECTS RETURN jack and send it to your DAW, etc, instead of using the reportedly horrible sounding "Emulated Out." Remember, you still need a speaker plugged in whenever the amp is on, to provide a proper impedance load on the power tubes, even in standby mode!

    And oh, I've tried all this in the past to confirm what I just stated, although I don't recall if the REVERB and MASTERS will still be in circuit (probably not) when taking the signal before the EFFECTS RETURN! I'm pretty sure the REVERB and MASTER VOLUMES are after the EFFECTS LOOP in the signal chain.

    Hope This Helps?
    Gene
     
  12. KraftyBob

    KraftyBob Well-Known Member

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    Thanks For the information, Gene. Unfortunately I have the older DSL - the C, not the CR - so I don't have the emulated out, etc. I'm going to try it this weekend and see what happens just to confirm, but I suspect that I'll need to stick with just mic'ing the amp.

    Thanks again!
     
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  13. junk notes

    junk notes Well-Known Member

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    @KraftyBob, @Gene Ballzz had best answer for your DSL. Just read your reply; sorry about that technical C to CR.
    Cool find BTW, @Gene Ballzz. noted.

    To answer your question on a standby and its functions; they are not needed in solid-state amps or other amps that were designed within the circuit. For whatever reason each manufacturer has their way to introduce their product. At times, a play on words for marketing.

    With (Marshall) Plexi's the standby switch when engaged supplies the preamp tubes with roughly 6.3v to run the heaters as not to shock the entire amp with roughly 120v. I cannot speak for any other amp other than pre CBS Fender's.
     
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  14. SkyMonkey

    SkyMonkey Well-Known Member

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    I have made a signal chain order for my DSL40CR. I think it's correct(ish):

    Hands - Guitar Strings - Pickup - Guitar Volume & Tone - Channel Gain - Preamp Tubes - Channel Volume - EQ & Tone Shift -
    FX Send - FX Return - Reverb - E/Out - Presence & Resonance - Master Volume - Power Switching (High-Low-Standby) -
    Power Amp Tubes - Speaker Out - (Attenuator?) - Speakers – Ears

    I have experimented with the controls and find that the Reverb is before the E/out but the Masters and Pres/Res are after.

    The E/out is still terrible though.
    Using the Multi Effect Headphone out would work, but could cause Stereo exclusion issues.
    i.e. Stereo TRS plug into mono Audio Interface TR jack.
    Better would be to use the FX Returns from the Multi Effect into the DAW Audio Interface.
     
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  15. marshallmellowed

    marshallmellowed Well-Known Member

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    Interesting videos on "Standby" switches (although a bit conflicting)...





     
    Last edited: Jul 30, 2020
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  16. Gene Ballzz

    Gene Ballzz Well-Known Member

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    Ahhh- So.......

    Let us know if/how it works or not?

    Just Askin'
    Gene
    Gene
     
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  17. Gene Ballzz

    Gene Ballzz Well-Known Member

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    There are multiple ways that "standby" switches get implemented/wired. Some would make it "OKAY" to switch a speaker connection while in "standby" and most others, DEFINITELY NOT! Best to NEVER switch speaker connections while in "standby" unless you like stressing/troubleshooting/replacing output transformers, tubes, resistors, etc!

    Its ElectriFRYin'
    Gene
     
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  18. marshallmellowed

    marshallmellowed Well-Known Member

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    Never seen a "Standby" switch on a tube amp, that wasn't wired to remove high voltage from the tubes. You cannot damage an amp by switching cabs with the high voltage removed from the tubes (in "Standby").
     
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  19. Gene Ballzz

    Gene Ballzz Well-Known Member

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    No desire for a piddlin' match here. Better safe than sorry.
    Your Amp, Your Choice.
    Gene
     
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  20. william vogel

    william vogel Active Member

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    This is the Marshall forum and every Marshall I’ve worked on, 60’s, 70’s, 80’s the standby switch controls the high voltage to the amp. If in standby you CAN swap speakers or instruments. I wouldn’t ever swap tubes without a complete power down.
     
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