Trainwreck Express Style Kits

[NMV87]

Hi guys/gals

As the title says, I am looking at buying an accurate Trainwreck Express kit. Initial thoughts are to buy a partially pre-assembled kit and purchase some good Pacific transformers myself to install.

Has anyone got any recommendations in kits? I was looking at both Ceriatone's TW Expression (previously owned a Chupacabra - great amp) and I hear Modulus Amplification in the U.K (https://modulusamplification.com/) make a kit as well (although I don't think you can buy pre-assembled).

My main reason for buying something like this partially pre-assembled is that I have heard these amps are a pain in the ass to get right and I also do not have to much spare time. My soldering skills are ok and I can get by with installing a PT and OT but I do not know of any good amp kit builders here in the Netherlands.

Would be good to get all of your opinions and whether someone on the forum has built a Trainwreck style amp before.

Cheers

 

[Guitar-Rocker]

You could buy a Trainwreck kit from Modulus amps and have Michael build it for you. Then if you desire to swap out transformers, do that on a proven amp. His build charge is 280 sterling, cost of the kit is another 440 sterling. That is without a cabinet or valves, but all of the rest. Add 152 sterling for valves, and/ or another 220 sterling for a cabinet. @ 1100 sterling for a ready to play amp $1370 US for a Trainwreck

 

[Dblgun]

Having built several Trainwreck style amps over the last year or so the details are pretty fresh in my noggin! My builds are from scratch and not from kit. I have tried to build these amps as close to the originals including as many original/equivalent as possible. I will say that you need to be aware that there is a wide variance in transformers from Pacific. Those who KF dealt with at Pacific are long gone. In my opinion they have attempted to capitalize on the previous relationship without doing the work needed to produce transformers closest to those originally used. Simply put, I have not found the current Pacific transformers to be as good as other options.


From those I have personally seen you could not go wrong with a kit from Nik at Ceriatone. As I'm sure you are aware the kits they offer are available in a number of states of completion. There is a significant amount of information on these amps over at the Amp Garage forum and I encourage you to visit there if you are interested in building these amps. To that end one of the members there (RJ) is known to provide a quality kit. I have not seen the kit but they have a good reputation. He has also in the past had transformers produced by several vendors and could probably provide options.

http://www.rjguitars.net/

 

[playloud]

Both excellent replies above. I highly recommend reading through some posts over at https://ampgarage.com/forum/ (you'll have to register to view schematics etc.)

The Pacific transformers (at least the stock ones) don't have a very good reputation. I believe the primary impedance of the OT is 7.5k, which doesn't match any known Trainwreck OTs.

Do you have any prior experience building amps? The Express would be an ambitious first build! That said, I repurposed an old amp to make mine and it turned out very well... perhaps I got lucky. However, you do have to be patient and methodical. If you're strapped for time, I would seriously consider the Modulus-built option @Guitar-Rocker suggests.

Btw, I'm aware of two Netherlands-based kit suppliers (Tone Factory and Jukebox Revival), but neither has an Express. An EU-based option might be Tube Town (Germany) - they have TW transformers (from Inmadout) and chassis; I bet they could supply the other components to make up a kit.

 

[NMV87]

Hi @Guitar-Rocker , @Dblgun and @playloud , thank you all so much for your detailed responses. I have been using the amp garage to do as much reading as I can. I did not know about the issues with the Pacific transformers not necessarily all being close to the original spec.

I have also been thinking about the build layout. Thanks for the link to rjguitars. I quite like the fact that in one of the kits two filter cap cans are used instead of the multiple caps silicones together within the chassis. Seems like it would be much easier and cleaner in terms of wiring. I will also reach out to Modulus Amps to see if this is also a layout they offer. Thanks all

 

[Ronquest]

Would be good to get all of your opinions and whether someone on the forum has built a Trainwreck style amp before.

I've built a TW clone using some of the last Classic Tone TW transformer sets before they closed up shop. It's a non-master volume amp and it gets loud to start sounding good. I didn't run into any oscillation or noise issues with my build. It was a very good sounding amp, just couldn't play it in the sweet spot in the house, ended up selling it before I modded it away from the TW schematic.

I'm not trying to talk you out of the build here, just what I've found personally as I dedicated over a 100 hours (lock-down time) in Fisher/TW research and building. There are variations on that amp and they are all a bit different. The general design is simple, just look at the schematic and build, it's practically a Fender Deluxe with a Marshall output and a cold clipper thrown in the middle. Ken is a legend in the amp world and I'd love to play one of his real Trainwrecks someday.

If you build one we'd love to see it and I'm sure you'll get support if you need it.

 

[Dblgun]

The EL34 Express is a loud amp for sure. I would put it right there with my 50w JMP at full tilt. KF's design was very touch sensitive and loud from about 2 on. The amps don't get a lot louder as you turn up but get much dirtier as the power and then pre amp sections overdrive. It is definitely a different beast from a Marshall.

I don't have any issues as my kids are gone and I live on several acres so my neighbors are not bothered.

If you think the amp with EL34s might be too much you may consider a lower output version. 6V6's is an option that KF did and a few here on the board have built lesser output versions using a variety of tubes. A few of the builds are in threads here. If you do build one plan on tinkering with different components to get it where you want. The amps by KF were hand built and varied from one to another. It is a great circuit that you can season to taste. I look forward to following your build should you decide to dive in!

 

[coffeecupman]

Hi guys.

I have in my head the brand Stancor for Trainwreck output transformers, from loose memory somewhere. Was Pacific the maker/parent company of Stancor? Or was that a different model Trainwreck (Liverpool, etc)?

 

[playloud]

Hi guys.

I have in my head the brand Stancor for Trainwreck output transformers, from loose memory somewhere. Was Pacific the maker/parent company of Stancor? Or was that a different model Trainwreck (Liverpool, etc)?

My understanding (not an expert by any means) is that the Stancor A-3801, which could be purchased off-the-shelf, was used by Ken in the first amps. They still show up on Reverb/Ebay occasionally but asking prices are excessive (e.g. here).

He then got Chris Merren to prototype a bespoke design, and these were ultimately produced by Pacific.

Glen Kuykendall has a cool comparison vid here:

 

[coffeecupman]

My understanding (not an expert by any means) is that the Stancor A-3801, which could be purchased off-the-shelf, was used by Ken in the first amps. They still show up on Reverb/Ebay occasionally but asking prices are excessive (e.g. here).

He then got Chris Merren to prototype a bespoke design, and these were ultimately produced by Pacific.

Glen Kuykendall has a cool comparison vid here:

Thanks a lot! That was really helpful

 

[Dblgun]

I have built clones with Stancor A3801's along with,Triad,Thordarson, Merit and other equivalents. I wouldn't necessarily get hung up on a specific name/model number. I've spent some time researching the topic and as usual reality is somewhat more boring than hype. There is some indication that KF had some experience in television repair. The PT's used in most of his amplifiers had their roots as TV replacements. As with many others things there was a fair amount of "industrial incest" in the transformer business. Chicago Transformer Corp made transformers which were relabeled for numerous companies who then sold them in their lines. There are equivalent transformers under several other names. KF used Stancor possibly because his local vendor was a Stancor dealer. Remember this was prior to the internet and a time where people actually did business locally. KF was reported to have bought a bunch of transformers some of which he liked and others that he culled from the bunch. As the supply dried up and he wanted more consistent OT's he looked to have transformers wound that were comparable to his favorites. Ultimately Pacific wound many but not all of those used in later amps.

The parts used by KF were good quality but not exotic in any way and again appear to be what was readily available from preferred local vendors. The application of these parts, careful scrutiny and the keen ear of KF is what made his amps so good.

 

[jmp45]

My understanding (not an expert by any means) is that the Stancor A-3801, which could be purchased off-the-shelf, was used by Ken in the first amps. They still show up on Reverb/Ebay occasionally but asking prices are excessive (e.g. here).

He then got Chris Merren to prototype a bespoke design, and these were ultimately produced by Pacific.

Glen Kuykendall has a cool comparison vid here:

Glen's Trainwreck demos are the best I've seen. So dynamic.

 

[Dblgun]

Glen's Trainwreck demos are the best I've seen. So dynamic.

I couldn't agree more. Glen's Orphan Annie and the "Ingrid" Express are the standards for my taste.

 

[roef]

the RJ pacific OT with a 6k6 Z is good