The Official Marshall Studio Vintage Thread Sv20h

Discussion in 'Marshall Amps' started by Michael Roe, Jan 26, 2019.

  1. Trapland

    Trapland Running Into Walls Silver Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2013
    Messages:
    1,378
    Likes Received:
    1,280
    Location:
    Minneapolis
    Just saying, if they had installed a MV it would have completely defeated the purpose of a low power plexi. It would have made it just another MV amp like the hundreds already in production.
     
  2. WellBurnTheSky

    WellBurnTheSky Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2019
    Messages:
    1,193
    Likes Received:
    2,712
    Location:
    South of France, Europe, Earth
    Of course it does cut some gain, part of the tone of a "Plexi" is hitting the PI hard and driving it into saturation. But I'd guess your question is kinda rhetorical.

    And I disagree with your saying that adding a PPIMV would have made it just another MV amp, the SV20 has a voicing that is markedly different from pretty much anything on the market (especially in that power and price range), because of the way the preamp is laid out (parallel channels and whatnot), while every 20w amp out there is either EL84s, or much higher gain and more compressed (and thus much less touch-sensitive).

    Also regarding the price: for an amp made in the UK, and very well made, 1000€ is VERY reasonable. Shipping, tariffs and currency exchange might make it pricier in the US, but hey, feel our pain, everything US-made (ie most good guitars, amps and effects) is pricier for us here in the EU. That's the way it is.
     
  3. Kinkless Tetrode

    Kinkless Tetrode Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2017
    Messages:
    1,488
    Likes Received:
    2,072
    Marshall already did this 12 years ago in the form of the Vintage Modern and it was not that successful in the market place. Part of the problem being that the PPI master still had to be set at 6 or higher to get the better tone.
     
    BftGibson, Chris4189, tce63 and 2 others like this.
  4. BftGibson

    BftGibson Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 28, 2018
    Messages:
    1,813
    Likes Received:
    4,750
    mine has been impressing me ever since i got it..have to approach it from a 4 holer mentality.. have to say..it really sits in the middle of my amps..it can go back for big & open or forward & rip your head off...havnt even stepped on a pedal with it yet, no need...i am learning a lesson lately..if you have a few M's around..a/b em..they all can end up reasonably close...but ya got have the right speakers & pups,
     
  5. WellBurnTheSky

    WellBurnTheSky Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2019
    Messages:
    1,193
    Likes Received:
    2,712
    Location:
    South of France, Europe, Earth
    Might have been a matter of timing though, iirc by then people were all about the Recto, Riveras and similarly high gain amps (and most pro players I know were trying to get their hands on a CAE 3+SE, we all were Lukather freaks back then, and finally knew what he was using), Marshall wasn't too fashionable at the time.
    I'd even guess that the VM might be much more successful if it was released today than it was back then.
     
    tce63 and Mitchell Pearrow like this.
  6. Mitchell Pearrow

    Mitchell Pearrow Well-Known Member VIP Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2018
    Messages:
    13,474
    Likes Received:
    25,509
    Location:
    Moreno Valley CA
    That’s to bad you didn’t get along with it bro, but we buy gear to please ourselves, it doesn’t work for you so be it, at least you gave it a go , mine is going nowhere! Cheers Mitch
     
    tce63 likes this.
  7. Trapland

    Trapland Running Into Walls Silver Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2013
    Messages:
    1,378
    Likes Received:
    1,280
    Location:
    Minneapolis
    . Not rhetorical I want to know. Is it the device lowering volume that changes tone and gain (i assumes you meant so) or is it use of the loop at all the changes gain.
    I guess adding “just another” does look encompassing. I should have said made it another MV based on a Marshall, which we have many. But still the reason the sv20 is selling so well is because it doesn’t have a master volume while still being low enough power to play cranked.
     
    Mitchell Pearrow and tce63 like this.
  8. WellBurnTheSky

    WellBurnTheSky Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2019
    Messages:
    1,193
    Likes Received:
    2,712
    Location:
    South of France, Europe, Earth
    Engaging or bypassing the loop in itself doesn't change the tone at all (I tested it with a clean boost pedal set at unity gain).
    BUT cutting some volume through the use of a volume box does lower the gain at some point (and when you have channels set pretty high). Which makes sense when you consider that part of the gain on this amp comes from slamming the PI and driving it into saturation, which was the idea behind using a PPIMV.

    I agree and disagree on this. The closest to the design of the SV20 (and the original NMV Marshalls) would be the Origin, which I must say I haven't played, but it seems slightly different. But you don't really have anything on the market that is similar in sound, feel, behavior and general philosophy, especially in that price bracket. I might be mistaken, but then, I'd be genuinely curious to know which amps you have in mind.
     
    Mitchell Pearrow and tce63 like this.
  9. Trapland

    Trapland Running Into Walls Silver Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2013
    Messages:
    1,378
    Likes Received:
    1,280
    Location:
    Minneapolis
    After building a couple and working on many, I’m still surprised at how similar some other amps are to the plexi type amps. I truly consider JTMs, JMPs, 2203-2204, DSL, Friedman, Jose modded, Soldano, heck even Crate Stealth and Peavey Windsor to be just modded plexis. All in the “family” of tones with not much more than a handful of differing part values between them.

    One may prefer this or that voicing, more or less gain, but they all came from the same Bassman DNA imho.

    Now Mesa, Rivera, post tweed Fender, Supro, Magnatone, Vox are another ilk. Ilks?

    I love that Marshall built a lower power EL34 plexi.
     
  10. WellBurnTheSky

    WellBurnTheSky Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2019
    Messages:
    1,193
    Likes Received:
    2,712
    Location:
    South of France, Europe, Earth
    Well, it was all incremental anyway, with Ken Bran, Dudley Craven and Ken Underwood copying the Bassman with a few tweaks to create the JTM45, then it going to EL34s and 100w (JTM45/100), to solid state rectifier to create the Lead/Superlead (and its variants), then channels being cascaded instead of being parallel to create the 2203/2204, then people starting adding gain stages (either solid state as in the 2210, the Dual Reverb and the Jubilee, or tube in the SLO) or diode clipping (isn't that what the Jose and then Cameron mods are ?), spawning the whole modded/boutique Marshall thing, and so on. In very broad strokes I know, but that's how I understand it.

    And instead of design, regarding the Origin, I should have said it's a similar "philosophy", if that makes any sense. In the way that it's a lower power, vintage voiced amp that emulates the parallel/blended channels idea.
    And I don't think there's any similar amps, lower wattage, EL34s, vintage voiced, in the 1k€ range. Unless I'm mistaken, the SV20H is pretty much unique in its price bracket, which definitely explains why it's that successful and no dealer anywhere in the world seems to manage keepin any in stock for more than a few days.
     
  11. oasis02

    oasis02 Member

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2010
    Messages:
    14
    Likes Received:
    61
    I was lucky enough to get a SV20H through the GC website this weekend and it arrived yesterday.

    Everything said absolutely rings true...particularly the LOUDNESS. I can play pretty loud at home, but I do need to attenuate this. I went the JHS route, and I'm actually pleased.

    With a Les Paul my sound clips sound very close in gain level to most others (youtube clips) when not using an OD pedal in front of the amp. At some point, I will open-it-up and see what I'm missing.

    The 1-watters are the only thing that got me close to what I have today. This is a great series!

     
    Andy79, Ian Alderman, scozz and 10 others like this.
  12. rich88uk

    rich88uk Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 25, 2009
    Messages:
    688
    Likes Received:
    693
    Location:
    Liverpool,UK
    How are finding it compares against the classic? Other then one being master volume.
     
    tce63 likes this.
  13. WellBurnTheSky

    WellBurnTheSky Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2019
    Messages:
    1,193
    Likes Received:
    2,712
    Location:
    South of France, Europe, Earth
    Congrats, that's a nice wall of amps you have here !
    And yeah, it's loud. Err, I mean...LOUD :lol: And yeah, it's surprisingly gainy (or maybe I could never get a NMV Marshall to the point where it actually gets that amount of gain and compression). Glad you like it as much as I do like mine.
     
    assaf110, Mitchell Pearrow and tce63 like this.
  14. oasis02

    oasis02 Member

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2010
    Messages:
    14
    Likes Received:
    61
    I've always chased that 800 snarl, so I have to give the edge to the Classic for my purposes. Also, the 800 does not need attenuation, the Vintage does in the home.

    Both take pedals extremely well (OD or Loop FX), and have the tone authenticity people forever chase. I sacrificed a Friedman BE50 Deluxe to get these with no regrets.
     
    dslman, scozz, Sacalait and 5 others like this.
  15. Msharky67

    Msharky67 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2012
    Messages:
    1,031
    Likes Received:
    734
    Location:
    Queensbury ,NY
    Has anybody tried those volume boxes with it? Does it work and help. I know the PPIMV maybe too much. I had thought what about those Yellowjacket tubes but I am not sure if those would fit. It wouldn't in the Origin. I felt the Origin was too clean and not enough tonal range. Every demo has the volume up past noon and gain maxed. Who uses an amp this way. Think about the green channel on the DSL. How it works and takes pedals. I wanted the Origin to be more like this. It did nothing better than my other models. I think I am going to save up for the SV20. I don't want to get an attenuater either. I am hoping that volume box will be enough. It doesn't need a lot. I never really heard a good demo of the Origin that I liked and said WOW! I want this next purchase to be the last. So I want to make it a good one. I like my current setup.
     
    dslman, Mitchell Pearrow and tce63 like this.
  16. rich88uk

    rich88uk Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 25, 2009
    Messages:
    688
    Likes Received:
    693
    Location:
    Liverpool,UK
    I've found the classic as the best out of the all amps I've ever head for pedals. It's just eats them, they all sound great. Much better then my mini jubilee.
     
    Trapland and tce63 like this.
  17. WellBurnTheSky

    WellBurnTheSky Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2019
    Messages:
    1,193
    Likes Received:
    2,712
    Location:
    South of France, Europe, Earth
    Yes I have. I actually built a single volume box (that's just two jacks and a pot mounted into a 1950A aluminium box, dead simple), then built a double one (switching from one setting to another via a 3PDT footswitch, plus a Klon-style buffer in front and LEDs to know which setting I'm on) yesterday.
    As mentioned above, it cuts a bit of gain, since you don't hit the PI as hard as you normally do when it's full on, but you can cut a fair amount of volume with them. Or just a tad, if that's all you need. But anyway, it still sounds very good, the FX loop is fairly transparent. No issue there at all.

    And to answer your 2nd question, the SV LOVES pedals. It takes them even better that my trusty DSL100 does. It's also even more touch-sensitive, really reacts perfectly to every nuances of your playing, and to manipulating guitar controls.
    I tested many pedals (I build them as a hobby, so I have dozens of boosts, OD and distortion boxes, plus the ones I'd purchased previously), and ended up settling for a Guvnor clone, my good old Maxon OD9, and a Monte Allums-modded SD-1. The Keeley-style DS-1 clone was pretty good as well, did that Vai on Eat 'Em And Smile thing perfectly.
     
    assaf110, Mitchell Pearrow and tce63 like this.
  18. oasis02

    oasis02 Member

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2010
    Messages:
    14
    Likes Received:
    61
    I had the opportunity to open-up the SV yesterday at full throttle.

    Now...I can describe the difference between this and attenuating through the loop with a volume knob.

    The sound does go from good to great. It's that simple. So, attenuating the front end became a priority. My best guess is that you cut 30% of the full gain capability when you attenuate via loop. Probably fine for some people, and it recorded nicely, but...it's not the full Plexi glory.

    I was able to grab a Tone King Iron man Mini Mk2 locally. It checked all the boxes for me, fits my landscape, and sounds great. I had this attenuator in a prior TK Royalist 45, and liked how it performed.

    Now we're in-gear!

     
  19. scozz

    scozz Well-Known Member Gold Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2008
    Messages:
    4,609
    Likes Received:
    10,508
    I agree with what you said about the SC20, it does take pedals extremely well and I love that it has a MV. I’m curious @oasis02, are you a strictly at home guitarist or do you also gig?

    I’ve been asking this question a few times now on a couple of forums. The reason is sometimes I feel a bit guilty spending so much money on one amp when I no longer gig.
     
    tce63 and Mitchell Pearrow like this.
  20. Mitchell Pearrow

    Mitchell Pearrow Well-Known Member VIP Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2018
    Messages:
    13,474
    Likes Received:
    25,509
    Location:
    Moreno Valley CA
    Do not let that fret ya Scozz, you need to enjoy it and not let things of that nature bug you. If you are enjoying what your ears are hearing, that’s what matters brother! Cheers Mitch
     

Share This Page