Pod Hd500 Midi Control Of Marshall Dsl100hr

Discussion in 'Marshall Amps' started by Elliot Twist, Mar 23, 2018.

  1. Elliot Twist

    Elliot Twist Member

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    Can anyone help me to understand and control a Marshall DSL100HR 100 watt guitar amp head using my POD HD500?
    I'm currently using the POD HD500 on the FX Loop of the amp for any effects necessary without amp models engaged.
    Mostly : Chorus, Flanger, Delay, Reverb, Pitch Shift, EQ, and Volume pedal. It works perfect and sounds fantastic.
    I know it's a crime to disengage the wonderful amp modeling, but nevertheless I'm happy.
    I can at least begin to guess that I can access the 6 modes available on the Marshall DSL100HR with the MIDI of the POD HD500.
    I will have no clue how to do it, and sure would appreciate any help with the matter.
    Once I get it figured out I'll post back here to share my results for the next person.
    There's several things that I'm sure can be controlled on the Marshall DSL100HR.
    What I'm looking for are control of "Clean and Crunch" modes of the Classic Gain Channel, and "OD1 and OD2" on the Ultra Gain Channel on the Marshall DSL100HR.
    Also FX Loop in and out, and switching between the 2 master volumes on the Marshall DSL100HR.
    Thanks in advance for any help. Wish me luck.
    The upcoming 6-button footswith from Marshall to control these functions has not been released yet Marshall PEDL-91016.
    It'll cost $200. I would rather use the Line 6 POD HD500 to do the work

    I've posted this question @ Line 6 also
     
  2. MonstersOfTheMidway

    MonstersOfTheMidway Well-Known Member

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    I don't have the new Marshall DSL100HR, but I'm kinda familiar with the HD500.

    First step is to make sure both amplifier and HD500 are on the same MIDI channel. If both are on the same channel, then connecting the the amplifier to the HD500 with a MIDI cable is the next step. Third, you'll have to go into the HD500 MIDI setup to start configuring options (due to the customization features of the HD500, you might have to read the manual to know how you want to set things up).

    I'm pretty sure that the DLS100HR can be setup to recall various switches as a group of presets because it looks like it can response to program change commands. For example, you can select a crunch mode +master volume 1 or 2 + effects loop on, and then save that group as a preset on the HD500 that can be recalled.

    What I'm not sure about is whether you can toggle individual button/switches on the DSL100HR using MIDI that can then be assigned to one of the footswitches on the HD500. I think it is possible because the DSL100HR manual lists "control number" information. Additionally, the manual states "MIDI commands allow the remote control of some front panel functions (refer to MIDI implementation chart at the end of this manual)." Again, I'm not sure if this is possible or how you can do this with the HD500, but you can try give it a try.

    The quickest way to get into MIDI with the DSL100HR and the HD500 is to create and save presets using program change (pc) in MIDI. Look into the HD500 manual for more info.

    Good luck with your gear. Let us know how things turn out.
     
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  3. mickeydg5

    mickeydg5 Well-Known Member

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    It is factory set to channel 1 but can be changed as well as use OMNI MODE.
     
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  4. Dmann

    Dmann Well-Known Member

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    WOW, I just looked at the manual.

    1st thing that pops out
    Note: When the 2-way footswitch is connected the amplifier will not respond to any MIDI messages.

    from the Manual

    Then the table says it only accepts program changes 0 -127, with amp channels mapped to every four PC values.

    so yeah... that's whacked and not really well explained......

    From what I've read on here about this amp, (I had one for a day but never tested the midi unfortunately), each channel remembers if the loop is on/off, and which master it's using, so I would guess they are calling this the "state." If this is true, then you can actually only really control the 4 channels via midi?

    If so, from your POD use Midi Channel 1(or whatever you want if you change it), PC 0 for clean, PC 1 for crunch, PC 2 for OD1, and PC 3 for OD2 would be my first guess.
     
  5. Elliot Twist

    Elliot Twist Member

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    Thank you !
     
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  6. Elliot Twist

    Elliot Twist Member

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    Thank you !
     
  7. Elliot Twist

    Elliot Twist Member

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    Thank you !
     
  8. Dmann

    Dmann Well-Known Member

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    Let us know your findings ;)
     
  9. Elliot Twist

    Elliot Twist Member

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    ...here's the current report.
    I have both the Marshall DSL100H and the Marshall DSL100HR. There's bundle of stuff they say and mention 'bout the upgrade to the DSL line.
    I'm believing it's true much of what they say. Especially Marshall.
    The voicing had been changed. Supposedly they tamed down any "harsh" high frequency. I never disliked it, I though it made the DDSL100H sound "mean", and vicious or aggressive.
    I suppose there's no more need to clip C19. (Yippee on the DSL20CR too.)
    Two Master Volumes that remember which was last used for each of the 4 modes.
    (Clean and Crunch on the Classic Gain Channel, and OD1 and OD 2 on the Ultra Gain Channel) ...and an FX Loop that also remembers if it was on or off for each last used mode.
    The "new" power scaling it's finally correct. (Yippee on the DSL20CR too.)
    MIDI access to the 4 modes. Works as suggested.
    I tried it on my Line 6 POD HD500 as the MIDI controller. For me, I'll wait for the 6 button footswitch that hasn't been released yet.
    I'm not so sure how I like what has to take place on the POD HD500 what with changing patches to send the mode change message to the DSL.
    ...plus I heard some clicking sound from the amp while switching between the 2 Master Volumes. (It does that even when pushing the button on the amp front).
    I tried the "Pedal Board Mode" on the POD HD500, and it uh... quit sending MIDI to the DSL. LoL, I'll just wait for the 6 button footswitch that hasn't been released yet.
    I hope the amp doesn't make a "click" when switching between the 2 Master Volumes with the DSL100HR 6-button footswitch.

    I actually only need a 2 Channel guitar amp. Now that there's 2 master volumes I can see myself using the modes more often.
    I'll just walk back to the amp head and choose the channel mode(s).
    Now any volume difference between modes can be remedied by compensating between memorized master volumes for the given mode.
    It doesn't memorize more than 2 volumes (there's 4 modes).
    I only need it for the volume jump between "Clean" and "Crunch" on the "Classic Gain", so now with the DSL100HR I'll be OK to switch between those without having to change the channel volume to compensate (eg: DSL100H).
    Volume jump between OD1 and OD 2 aren't as rude. OD2 is a tad louder, but I don't care. If I'm choosing OD2 I'm choosing to be a tad louder.
    Running both Master Volumes on 10 is unity gain. (If you're comparing the DSL100H with the DSL100HR that's good info.)
    The wild thing that I can't verify yet is that there's the possibility to get some sounds from the "new" DSL by using the Master Volumes as a "choke", and cranking the channels.
    OH... yes why not? What if you can get this amp to burn and use the Masters to choke it for "bedroom" volume?
    I ain't tried that yet. I've been playin' it a bit cranked. Heck I just only got it a few weeks ago. I'm not ready to test it for apartment volume. (I might never) maybe.
     
    Last edited: Apr 17, 2018
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  10. Elliot Twist

    Elliot Twist Member

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    Thanks for viewing and liking. I'll post more as I continue to engage further with the DSL100HR. When my guitarist and I rolled the DSL100H into the closet for a much deserved break, we felt sad as if we were putting it in an "old folks home". Not to worry that "mean" DSL100H won't be on break all the time. If I get a bug I'll take it home and use my power soak on it. Note: I have the DSL20CR at home, and I'm very happy with it.
     
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  11. _ripper_

    _ripper_ Well-Known Member

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    You're actually the first person I've seen here that has owned both the 100H and 100HR for a period of time. Would you care to elaborate on the difference between them on the Ultra Gain channel?

    Thanks!
     
  12. crankyrayhanky

    crankyrayhanky Member

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    Here’s info I received on the midi





    On the DSL each of the 4 channels clean, crunch, OD1, OD2 are assigned in a loop to every four MIDI program change messages and can’t be changed e.g.



    PC 00 = CLEAN

    PC 01 = CRUNCH

    PC 02 = OD1

    PC 03 = OD2



    PC 04 = CLEAN

    PC 05 = CRUNCH

    PC 06 = OD1

    PC 07 = OD2



    PC 08 = CLEAN etc.









    Connect the MIDI controller to the DSL – MIDI Out to MIDI In. Multiple equipment can be connected using MIDI thrus where available. Always ensure each piece of connected equipment is set to a different MIDI channel.



    Set the receive MIDI channel on the DSL, this only needs to be done once.…



    Press and hold the Loop On/Off switch (Front Panel Function #23) while powering up the amplifier to activate MIDI waiting mode.



    The LED will flash until a valid MIDI command is received.



    Send a MIDI PC command on the required MIDI channel from the connected controller to the DSL.



    The MIDI receive channel on the DSL will now be set.



    If the user just wants to recall one variation of each channel, they can select each channel in turn from the front panel and set the state of the FX loop and Master (the switch settings are remembered per channel). They then only need to set their MIDI controller to send the appropriate program change message to recall that channel on the DSL.



    If the user wishes to have multiple variations of each channel recalled e.g. Clean with FX Loop on and Master 1 and then clean with FX Loop Off and Master 2. They will need to set their controller to send a program change message to select the DSL’s channel and then MIDI CC messages to set the state of the FX Loop and Master.



    e.g.



    Clean with FX Loop On and Master 1



    Send…



    PC=00 [DSL Clean Channel]

    CC=13 Value = 1 [DSL FX Loop On]

    CC=14 Value = 0 [DSL Master 1]



    Clean with FX Loop Off and Master 2



    Send…



    PC=00 [DSL Clean Channel]

    CC=13 Value = 0 [DSL FX Loop Off]

    CC=14 Value = 1 [DSL Master 2]



    One final thing to note. When the 2-way footswitch is connected the amplifier will not respond to any MIDI messages and the channels won’t recall the saved state of the FX Loop (the 2-way overrides it), but the 6-way can be used without
     
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  13. Elliot Twist

    Elliot Twist Member

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    I will get to responding as soon as I can. However, at this time I am spending time to get the "new" DSL100HR adjusted to sound perfect to me. The two amps are definitely a bit different, and I've placed the DSL100H on vacation. Also I'm not certain that I can truly compare only the OD2 between the 100H and 100HR. I can say for sure that the "voicing" has been changed in this "new" DSL series. On the DSL100HR the Low Mids are increased, and the unnecessary piercing highs have been curled off. Maybe on the "new" DSL series folks won't feel the need to clip C19 (lookup the C19 MOD for the DSL100H).
    ...and now I think I will have the "old" DSL100H modified to include a mini toggle switch on the back of the amp that clips and un-clips the C19.
     
    Last edited: Apr 22, 2018
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  14. Elliot Twist

    Elliot Twist Member

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    Thank you very much! I will get back to fooling with the MIDI some day, but for now I've given up on it because I don't like the behavior with changing patches on the Line 6 POD HD500 just to institute a MIDI change on the DSL100HR. Yes the 2-way overrides the MIDI. Changing patches on a device like the POD HD500 isn't perfectly seamless, switching between a clean sound and a dirty sound creates some latency. Not good for me.
    Also even though the two Master volumes on the DSL100HR are nice for compensating between the "Clean" and "Crunch" within the Classic Gain Channel, but there's a clicking sound when the switch is made between the two master volumes. Not good for me. It does this on the amp front too. I hope the $200 6-way footswitch doesn't do this. I can see the option of switching between the "Clean" and "Crunch" within the Classic Gain Channel as being very useful to me on the fly with the master volumes compensating for the volume jump between the two modes. BUT NOT with any clicking sound or any latency. It must be seamless for me. Regardless of it all I will be walking back to the amp sometimes now and utilizing the "Clean" or "Crunch" within the Classic Gain Channel on the "new" DSL100HR. This wasn't feasible on the "older" DSL100H because it wasn't simply the push of a button due to the volume jump between the two modes. Pushing a button is fine, fiddling with knobs isn't.
    I hate to say I'm old and lazy, but playing Guitar since 72 without MIDI, and now having the option seems interesting. But I'm letting the MIDI alone for now. LoL, however now I have to do all this crap on my EVH 5150III 1X12 Combo, because the volume jump between the green channel and the blue channel on that amp is absolutely terrible volume jump. Using MIDI there and patch changes on the POD HD500 can solve this. I hope it's seamless and quiet on the EVH.
    ...and thanks a lot EVH for fixing this on the "new" series of that amp (man am I pissed).
     
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  15. Mattihafler

    Mattihafler New Member

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    A bit of a bump but this was the most usefull thread I could find on the subject.

    I have a Line 6 HX Effects. As stated above I made a list of settings I would want to program.
    Standard the DSL100HR is on MIDI Channel 1 so I just left it there.

    On the HX Effects I can ad several instances to a MIDI message.
    So for instance i did the following:

    Instant 1:

    MIDI CC
    MIDI Channel = 1
    CC# = 14
    Value = 0

    Instant 2:
    BankPC
    MIDI Channel = 1
    Bank CC00 = Off
    Bank CC32 = off
    Program = 0

    This activates the Green Master volume and Classic Gain Green.
    So far So good....
    But I would expect that if would NOT change the MIDI CC (and leave that on value 0) then if i change the Bank PC Program I should get the 4 different channels, all on the Green Master volume...
    But in my eyes the Master Volume changes to Red without any reason for it doing so...even though the MIDI CC value is same on all 4 SnapShots.

    Any one an idea?
     
  16. Ryq

    Ryq New Member

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    Yo! Same issue here. I believe the problem is either with:

    1. How Marshall implemented the MIDI.

    2. The weird way the amp memorizes the loop and master volume status per mode.

    3. The hardware's inability to read and parse serial data as needed and expected.

    In regards to these situations:

    1. it would probably be better practice for the combinations of channel, mode, loop, and master volume settings to each have their own program change message instead of relying on CC messages for loop and master volume functions.

    E.g. PC001 = classic/clean/loop-off/master-1
    then PC002 = classic/clean/loop-off/master2
    PC003 = classic/clean/loop-on/master
    etc.

    By my count, only 16 PC messages would be needed to cover everything.

    2. the way the amp memorizes how the loop and master were set the last time the mode was used is probably useful for folks running basic setups. However, for those needing more control (e.g. using the same rig for multiple acts), this is not the extent of the MIDI implementation that we anticipated from reading the product descriptions. We expect to easily transfer between any combinations of channel, mode, loop, and master. There should be a way to disable this "loop/master memory" and to prioritize CC messages regarding loop/master status.

    3. it is possible that the hardware running the MIDI operations inside the amp just isn't robust enough to receive a PC message, make the necessary changes, and also read the immediately following CC message. If this is the case, it is a distinct failure on the part of Marshall as MIDI is simple data.

    At any rate, I haven't found a work around yet. Hopefully Marshall takes notice as this is really close to false-advertisement as far as saying there is MIDI control but also it's too clunky, or too inept, or some other function (i.e. the memory of loop/master state) is preventing the full use we expected from the product description, manual, etc.

    Anyone out there able to control this amp as expected via the provided MIDI implementation chart in the manual?
     
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  17. Mitchell Pearrow

    Mitchell Pearrow Well-Known Member

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    Welcome to the forum! Cheers Mitch
     
  18. JacksonCharvelAddict

    JacksonCharvelAddict Well-Known Member

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    The HD500 has a fairly robust Midi implementation. I have been wanting to get mine setup to change patches on my old Alessis rack gear but it looks harder than building an Oracle Cluster.
     
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