Not sure which Studio amp to get. Mostly after clean-ish edge of breakup tones.

stefann

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As the title says I want something that does a good clean-ish tone, the kind that gets overdriven if you hit the top strings hard on the bridge pickup but doesn't sound like you have an overdrive pedal on. I have an attenuator for home use so bright cap isn't an issue. I'm planning on using an SD-1 or maybe buying a dedicated boost to unlock the sweet Marshall overdrive, I also have a couple fuzz pedals and a Rat that I use for specific things so I don't want an overwhelming amount of gain on the amp.

It's pretty hard to find good "clean" demos of these amps because everyone cranks them to 10 because apparently that's what you're supposed to do with Marshalls. I know the Plexi should be the "cleanest" because it's the most vintage-y or whatever, but almost every demo it feels like by the time you reach 9 o clock on the volume it already sounds like an overdrive pedal, and there are almost no good demos of the low-sensitivity inputs. The Silver Jubilee has a dedicated "clean channel" but even that seems to not stay clean for very long.
The SuperFunAwesomeHappyTime Pedal Show has a great SC20H demo and I'm super impressed with the clean sound of the Low input, even with the Master way up and the preamp on 5-6! So this has put the mini JCM in the lead, which is surprising to me because between the Plexi being an older circuit and the Jubilee having a clean channel, the JCM was initially the last I considered.

What would you pick? Any SV20H owners getting usable clean-ish edge of breakup tones that keep up with a sane drummer? Should I just get the JCM? For what it's worth I like the Plexi look the best by far so I would love it if that turned out to be the better choice, but I do have a special place in my heart for the JCM since I grew up listening to it :p
 

mustafa

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You can use the low input of Normal channel in SV20. It stays clean at a pretty high volume... but will it work for you depends on how loud your drummer is :) With 4 inputs and jumping options, you have a better chance with SV20 compared to SC20. I am myself using SV20 as an on the edge breakup clean pedal platform.
 

Benny2112

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My only experience here is with the SV20H, but I have found the clean tones on this amp to be amazing. In my band setting playing completely clean is a rarity, but just playing on my own I have experimented with the clean tones.

You should have no trouble getting clean and edge of breakup tones at gig/band practice volumes with this amp, but you will need to work the volume control on your guitar. This amp responds extremely well to guitar volume control adjustments.
 

marshallmellowed

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As the title says I want something that does a good clean-ish tone, the kind that gets overdriven if you hit the top strings hard on the bridge pickup but doesn't sound like you have an overdrive pedal on. I have an attenuator for home use so bright cap isn't an issue. I'm planning on using an SD-1 or maybe buying a dedicated boost to unlock the sweet Marshall overdrive, I also have a couple fuzz pedals and a Rat that I use for specific things so I don't want an overwhelming amount of gain on the amp.

It's pretty hard to find good "clean" demos of these amps because everyone cranks them to 10 because apparently that's what you're supposed to do with Marshalls. I know the Plexi should be the "cleanest" because it's the most vintage-y or whatever, but almost every demo it feels like by the time you reach 9 o clock on the volume it already sounds like an overdrive pedal, and there are almost no good demos of the low-sensitivity inputs. The Silver Jubilee has a dedicated "clean channel" but even that seems to not stay clean for very long.
The SuperFunAwesomeHappyTime Pedal Show has a great SC20H demo and I'm super impressed with the clean sound of the Low input, even with the Master way up and the preamp on 5-6! So this has put the mini JCM in the lead, which is surprising to me because between the Plexi being an older circuit and the Jubilee having a clean channel, the JCM was initially the last I considered.

What would you pick? Any SV20H owners getting usable clean-ish edge of breakup tones that keep up with a sane drummer? Should I just get the JCM? For what it's worth I like the Plexi look the best by far so I would love it if that turned out to be the better choice, but I do have a special place in my heart for the JCM since I grew up listening to it :p
Of the Studio amps, the SV20 does a better job of what you're describing. In fact, non-master volume Marshalls, in general, do a better job than master volume amps. The issue is volume, especially if you're playing with a drummer, or in a band. A low powered amp (5w, 20w...) will run out of headroom much quicker (clean volume) than a higher powered amp. If you're mic'ing the speaker through a PA, it's not an issue, as you don't have to crank the amp up much. If you're using the amp/cab to provide all of your sound (no PA), you may want to look at a JTM45 or 1987x. Even the JTM45, which is around 35 actual watts, can run out of headroom with a loud drummer (no PA). Hope that helps.
 
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pedecamp

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As the title says I want something that does a good clean-ish tone, the kind that gets overdriven if you hit the top strings hard on the bridge pickup but doesn't sound like you have an overdrive pedal on. I have an attenuator for home use so bright cap isn't an issue. I'm planning on using an SD-1 or maybe buying a dedicated boost to unlock the sweet Marshall overdrive, I also have a couple fuzz pedals and a Rat that I use for specific things so I don't want an overwhelming amount of gain on the amp.

It's pretty hard to find good "clean" demos of these amps because everyone cranks them to 10 because apparently that's what you're supposed to do with Marshalls. I know the Plexi should be the "cleanest" because it's the most vintage-y or whatever, but almost every demo it feels like by the time you reach 9 o clock on the volume it already sounds like an overdrive pedal, and there are almost no good demos of the low-sensitivity inputs. The Silver Jubilee has a dedicated "clean channel" but even that seems to not stay clean for very long.
The SuperFunAwesomeHappyTime Pedal Show has a great SC20H demo and I'm super impressed with the clean sound of the Low input, even with the Master way up and the preamp on 5-6! So this has put the mini JCM in the lead, which is surprising to me because between the Plexi being an older circuit and the Jubilee having a clean channel, the JCM was initially the last I considered.

What would you pick? Any SV20H owners getting usable clean-ish edge of breakup tones that keep up with a sane drummer? Should I just get the JCM? For what it's worth I like the Plexi look the best by far so I would love it if that turned out to be the better choice, but I do have a special place in my heart for the JCM since I grew up listening to it :p
Depends on the tone and features you want, 800, plexi, Jube, DSL, they are all different, they can all do clean and dirty. Try before you buy if you can or buy from a retailer with a good return policy. I bought the 20 watt DSL, Origin, SC20 and SV20 and returned them all except the SV20H. :yesway:
 

stefann

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Depends on the tone and features you want, 800, plexi, Jube, DSL, they are all different, they can all do clean and dirty. Try before you buy if you can or buy from a retailer with a good return policy. I bought the 20 watt DSL, Origin, SC20 and SV20 and returned them all except the SV20H. :yesway:

Well I really just want something that does the "Marshall thing" when cranked/boosted, but allows me to live in a mellower clean-ish edge of breakup territory with a tiny bit of hair on it, so that it works well with my fuzzes and my Rat.
 

stefann

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You can use the low input of Normal channel in SV20. It stays clean at a pretty high volume... but will it work for you depends on how loud your drummer is :) With 4 inputs and jumping options, you have a better chance with SV20 compared to SC20. I am myself using SV20 as an on the edge breakup clean pedal platform.
That's what I was hoping to hear. So the low input on the SV20 stays pretty clean at high volumes without the need to fiddle with the guitar volume knob too much?
 

stefann

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Nothing stays "clean" at high volumes, with a 20w amp. I consider "high volumes" as loud drummer volumes.
I don't need pristine Fender cleans, I'm fine with a little bit of hair, I just don't want it to sound like I'm on the "gain channel" of an amp all the time, or like I have an overdrive pedal always on with the gain past 9 o clock. Not really sure how to get across what I'm thinking, haha. I just want it to sound like I'm playing an old style tube amp without a lot of gain in it, turned up pretty loud so it starts breaking up, and with the option to kick in a boost to get that cranked Marshall drive that everyone loves. I see you own both the SV20H and the SC20H, do you think either of them fits this bill?

As far as volume, we'll definitely be mic'd up at gigs, and for rehearsal I guess there's a bit of leeway as far as the amount of gain, but there's never gonna be any time where the drummer is going at it hard and I have to play super clean.
 

dro

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I got the 2525h for the cleans. (pedal platform) Was the last amp I bought. Bought for ease of carry and sparkley cleans.
Have yet to put into a band environment. So I can't really say about vol. level.
But gets pretty loud. Using rhythm clip.
My normal gigging rig was a JTM45 with a very loud drummer.
So I know what to look for.
I dumped the Orange OR15- not enough volume.
As well as the Marshall Origin20h- Didn't have the tone.
 

stefann

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I got the 2525h for the cleans. (pedal platform) Was the last amp I bought. Bought for ease of carry and sparkley cleans.
Have yet to put into a band environment. So I can't really say about vol. level.
But gets pretty loud. Using rhythm clip.
My normal gigging rig was a JTM45 with a very loud drummer.
So I know what to look for.
I dumped the Orange OR15- not enough volume.
As well as the Marshall Origin20h- Didn't have the tone.
Cool. How far can you turn the input gain up on the 2525H before you're officially "past the edge" of breakup? Also do you use humbuckers or single coils? I have both, but plan on mostly using humbuckers. They're fairly low output PAF-style humbuckers though. (Seth Lover Alnico4's)

How would you say the cleans on the 2525H compare to JTM45 cleans? I love the idea of a JTM45 but can't justify it to my wallet (or back) for now
 

marshallmellowed

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I don't need pristine Fender cleans, I'm fine with a little bit of hair, I just don't want it to sound like I'm on the "gain channel" of an amp all the time, or like I have an overdrive pedal always on with the gain past 9 o clock. Not really sure how to get across what I'm thinking, haha. I just want it to sound like I'm playing an old style tube amp without a lot of gain in it, turned up pretty loud so it starts breaking up, and with the option to kick in a boost to get that cranked Marshall drive that everyone loves. I see you own both the SV20H and the SC20H, do you think either of them fits this bill?

As far as volume, we'll definitely be mic'd up at gigs, and for rehearsal I guess there's a bit of leeway as far as the amount of gain, but there's never gonna be any time where the drummer is going at it hard and I have to play super clean.
Posted this earlier, maybe you missed it...

Of the Studio amps, the SV20 does a better job of what you're describing. In fact, non-master volume Marshalls, in general, do a better job than master volume amps. The issue is volume, especially if you're playing with a drummer, or in a band. A low powered amp (5w, 20w...) will run out of headroom much quicker (clean volume) than a higher powered amp. If you're mic'ing the speaker through a PA, it's not an issue, as you don't have to crank the amp up much. If you're using the amp/cab to provide all of your sound (no PA), you may want to look at a JTM45 or 1987x. Even the JTM45, which is around 35 actual watts, can run out of headroom with a loud drummer (no PA). Hope that helps.
 
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pedecamp

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Well I really just want something that does the "Marshall thing" when cranked/boosted, but allows me to live in a mellower clean-ish edge of breakup territory with a tiny bit of hair on it, so that it works well with my fuzzes and my Rat.
They can all do it, you have to decide on the tone and features you want! :yesway:
 
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stefann

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Posted this earlier, maybe you missed it...

Of the Studio amps, the SV20 does a better job of what you're describing. In fact, non-master volume Marshalls, in general, do a better job than master volume amps. The issue is volume, especially if you're playing with a drummer, or in a band. A low powered amp (5w, 20w...) will run out of headroom much quicker (clean volume) than a higher powered amp. If you're mic'ing the speaker through a PA, it's not an issue, as you don't have to crank the amp up much. If you're using the amp/cab to provide all of your sound (no PA), you may want to look at a JTM45 or 1987x. Even the JTM45, which is around 35 actual watts, can run out of headroom with a loud drummer (no PA). Hope that helps.

Thanks! Can I ask why it is you say non-master volume Marshalls do a better job? Is it because of the bright cap on the preamp? Does the SV20 preamp break up later on the volume knob than the JCM?
 

WellBurnTheSky

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I tend to concur with @marshallmellowed though it depends a lot on 1) what speakers/cab you intend to use it with, 2) how loud you need to be.
I LOVE my SV20H, it's an amazing amp, I've gigged it a lot between getting it in late April '19 and the moment CoVid happened and never have been that happy with an amp. But with that said, at stage volume (competing with a rock drummer) it breaks up pretty early, especially with humbuckers. Though it's already pretty loud in that scenario. Basically, you have a choice between using mostly the High Treble channel, that breaks up pretty early (almost immediately) but has that classic Marshall tone, or using mostly the Normal channel that remains clean longer but has a more wooly breakup.
Even though the SV does great edge-of-breakup tones, it's obviously mainly designed to get the "raging Plexi" thing at a (mostly) sensible volume...or at least a manageable one.
BUT if you want edge of breakup AND gig volume, a JTM45 or 1987x might be a better choice indeed. I've owned a Ceriatone JTM45 that I've also gigged quite a bit, and it's one of the best clean/mostly clean tones out there, and takes pedals beautifully. For your use case, it might be the ticket.

And to me what sets the NMV Marshalls apart from MV ones (so, the SC) is the parallel channels, it sounds richer and more complex. I'd guess that's @marshallmellowed 's opinion as well. At least it's a sound I've never heard coming out of any MV amp.
 

marshallmellowed

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Thanks! Can I ask why it is you say non-master volume Marshalls do a better job? Is it because of the bright cap on the preamp? Does the SV20 preamp break up later on the volume knob than the JCM?
Don't think the bright cap has anything to do with it. Not sure I can give an accurate technical explanation, but I can tell you that, in my experience, non-master volume amps just seem to be more sensitive to picking dynamics than master volume amps. I can "theorize" that preamp tubes tend to enter into clipping much more abruptly than output tubes, where output tubes seem to be more gradual (pick lightly, clean, pick a litter harder, a little breakup...). I've found that running a master volume amp with the master on 10, and using only the channel volume, gets closer to a non-master amp's dynamics, but still not the same.
 
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marshallmellowed

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I tend to concur with @marshallmellowed though it depends a lot on 1) what speakers/cab you intend to use it with, 2) how loud you need to be.
I LOVE my SV20H, it's an amazing amp, I've gigged it a lot between getting it in late April '19 and the moment CoVid happened and never have been that happy with an amp. But with that said, at stage volume (competing with a rock drummer) it breaks up pretty early, especially with humbuckers. Though it's already pretty loud in that scenario. Basically, you have a choice between using mostly the High Treble channel, that breaks up pretty early (almost immediately) but has that classic Marshall tone, or using mostly the Normal channel that remains clean longer but has a more wooly breakup.
Even though the SV does great edge-of-breakup tones, it's obviously mainly designed to get the "raging Plexi" thing at a (mostly) sensible volume...or at least a manageable one.
BUT if you want edge of breakup AND gig volume, a JTM45 or 1987x might be a better choice indeed. I've owned a Ceriatone JTM45 that I've also gigged quite a bit, and it's one of the best clean/mostly clean tones out there, and takes pedals beautifully. For your use case, it might be the ticket.

And to me what sets the NMV Marshalls apart from MV ones (so, the SC) is the parallel channels, it sounds richer and more complex. I'd guess that's @marshallmellowed 's opinion as well. At least it's a sound I've never heard coming out of any MV amp.
Yes, the ability to mix the 2 inputs definitely sets the 4 holers apart from a typical master volume amp. Some think they can just crank the master of a master volume amp, an it somehow takes on a "Plexi" character, but unfortunately, it's not that simple. It does, however, give a master volume amp a slightly "different" character, which can be useful.
 

dro

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Cool. How far can you turn the input gain up on the 2525H before you're officially "past the edge" of breakup? Also do you use humbuckers or single coils? I have both, but plan on mostly using humbuckers. They're fairly low output PAF-style humbuckers though. (Seth Lover Alnico4's)

How would you say the cleans on the 2525H compare to JTM45 cleans? I love the idea of a JTM45 but can't justify it to my wallet (or back) for now


The cleans are closer than anything I'd heard to the JTM45 in a small low power amp.
At the time. The Origin, the Mini Jubilee, and DSL were the only 20 watters I was looking at. DSL was clearly off the table right off the bat. Never played one I liked.
First I got the Origin 20h (like everybody else) It was the least expensive option. I was happy with it for about an hour. Maybe less. Tone in no way was even close to what the JTM45 delivered.
A friend owned a shop 30 miles away. Thought I might like to try an Orange OR15.
If all I was playing was Black Sabbath it would've been perfect.
Went to the San Luis guitar show. Ran into a guy who had the Jubilee combo. Plugged in one of my Les Paul's and I couldn't stop playing. I played till a guy came over and bought the guitar from me.
I still have yet to put it in a situation with a live band.
It is kind of a different animal though. as far as settings.
I don't try to make it anything other than what I bought it for.
It makes me want to play.
 


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