In search of authentic plexi tones at practical volumes and setups

tallcoolone

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I hate to tell you but you are absolutely chasing an impossibility.

1. Our ears don’t even have the same frequency response at low volume than they do at high volume. Kind of game over right there.
2. A speaker does not produce sound the same at .5 watts as it does 50 watts.. You have two primary magnetic characteristics where one dominates and colours the response at low volume and the other at high volume in a completely different way, as well very similar mechanical changes of suspension and cone behaviour.
3. Different speakers, 4x12’s (or 8 x12’s) arrays configurations, and different cabinet volume, dimensions, style (open, closed, ported), will never sound like anything else. I.E. a 1x12 small volume open back will NEVER sound anything like those big cabs. Can’t change physics.
4. Feedback & Dynamics are a function of volume (amplification).

For better or worse, modeling is the only thing that can ROUGHLY correct most of this crap and approximate these complexities at low volumes: it’s so good these days that the limitations are usually poor quality (not very linear) headphones or speakers due to a lack of one’s knowledge, research, and/or funds. Look, I have owed and played most the iconic amps, the studio series, DSL’s, and modellers. No replacement for displacement. Nothing sounds like an opened up classic 100 watter on the appropriate stack for A certain sound. Nothing!! .. but IMO those rigs also do not sound inspiring at low volume. I don’t really care for modellers in general but I still chose to use mine when I’m stuck in a no or low volume situation.
What he said. Hate to use the word but if you need to play quieter than a loud home stereo than your ‘best‘ tone is going to come from a modeling/full range monitor setup rather than guitar speakers.
 

JBA

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Well firstly your Dsl5 combo is made in Vietnam not China, and the Plexi crunch you’re looking for lives in the Marshall SV20. It’s a 20/5 watt amp, made in England, head or combo, that’ll get you where you want to go.

I’ve heard some say the green channel in the Dsl can get fairly close to a Plexi tone, when cranked and using an od pedal as a clean boost. I don’t have any idea if that’s the case, I don’t own one. Have you tried that?
Yep, green channel 1 watt, open up the volume, adjust the pedal for gain to taste and USE the volume and tone on your guitar. SV20 can get closer in tone but it’s way to loud for what he is looking for. With the wrong cab and way less volume both amps don't get there anyway.. no sense in waisting a bunch more cash to still not sound the same.
 

tallcoolone

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I really would'nt want to play anywhere where a sv 20 in 5 watt mode woud'nt work. Plus you could use a pedal of some sort to goose it like a timmy.just my .02
Well you say that until you are forced into a situation where you want to play the guitar but you really can’t make much noise lol. Happens to all of us at some point and in those situations it is nice to still be able to have tone that inspires us, right? The right modeling rig can make all the difference in those situations and nowadays you don’t need to drop a lot of coin to get there.
 

Derrick111

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I'm with Buzzard... if 5w is too much for any show I'm playing, I'm at the wrong show. Hell, I still say that about my 50w JCM800 combo ;) . But I would draw the line at a 5w-18w combo seriously. Playing computers is no fun and uninspiring. It ain't gonna happen. Sorry.
 

tallcoolone

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I'm with Buzzard... if 5w is too much for any show I'm playing, I'm at the wrong show. Hell, I still say that about my 50w JCM800 combo ;) . But I would draw the line at a 5w-18w combo seriously. Playing computers is no fun and uninspiring. It ain't gonna happen. Sorry.
So people who live in cities and apartments can’t play guitar? And what percentage of your playing is alone at home vs at a show?
 

Derrick111

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Not saying that. Read my statement again... i said SHOW. I have a low watt amp that I used when I lived in an apartment. No computer required. I play more at home then on the road or local shows. If 5w is too much at a show, then it's the wrong show for me and my audience.
 

solarburnDSL50

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Well firstly your Dsl5 combo is made in Vietnam not China, and the Plexi crunch you’re looking for lives in the Marshall SV20. It’s a 20/5 watt amp, made in England, head or combo, that’ll get you where you want to go.

I’ve heard some say the green channel in the Dsl can get fairly close to a Plexi tone, when cranked and using an od pedal as a clean boost. I don’t have any idea if that’s the case, I don’t own one. Have you tried that?

My 40C gets Plexi like. The green clean is where I do it boosted with my fav od's. The amp volume needs to be high and amp gain high then boost. Still missing the bigger open notes and in your face Sound field. I call it vintage Marshall as not to upset any Plexi lovers...like me.:D

Most would use green crunch. I found better green clean set up pushing power and gain and then pushed again by an OD.
 

tallcoolone

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Not saying that. Read my statement again... i said SHOW. I have a low watt amp that I used when I lived in an apartment. No computer required. I play more at home then on the road or local shows. If 5w is too much at a show, then it's the wrong show for me and my audience.
Maybe I wasn’t paying attention but I don’t think many (any?) folks are complaining that 5w is too much for a show. Most players spend the vast majority of their time playing alone at home, and a large percentage of those people need to keep the volume down.

While I appreciate the old school ‘tubes or die‘ attitude if you can’t get motivated playing a well dialed in Helix/Kemper/AXE rig I don’t know what to tell ya. Have you tried these options?
 

Derrick111

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Maybe I wasn’t paying attention but I don’t think many (any?) folks are complaining that 5w is too much for a show.

Buzzard said he really wouldn't want to play anywhere where a sv 20 in 5 watt mode woud'nt work. I agreed by saying I also would not. If by "anywhere" he meant popping around to other bedrooms, then I misunderstood.

While I appreciate the old school ‘tubes or die‘ attitude if you can’t get motivated playing a well dialed in Helix/Kemper/AXE rig I don’t know what to tell ya. Have you tried these options?

Yep, I have and they are poop. Uninspiring to play and often lifeless to listen to. BTW, nobody said it had to be tubes... I play solid state sometimes too. You should see this more as a analog/hardware vs software generated sound stance. Playing computers is a new school option that so many find uninspiring. It's all swell that you are willing to play a computer or get inspiration elsewhere, but that doesn't effect the validity of anyone else's choice.
 

tallcoolone

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Sorry ,I just meant strictly playing show's.
Agreed--I can't imagine any show with a drummer not overwhelming the 5w setting on the two Studio amps I have. Honestly if the 20w setting is too loud I'll use modeling and full range monitors, IMO it sounds heads and shoulders better than a weak signal through a guitar speaker.
 

marshallmellowed

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Yep, I have and they are poop. Uninspiring to play and often lifeless to listen to.

Sorry, but this statement tells me that, either you haven't played through a "properly setup" Axe FX rig, or you haven't played through one at all. I have several tube amps, love them, and if your statement had any validity, I wouldn't be using an Axe Fx for live gigs. If it wasn't both inspiring, and sounded every bit as good as my tube amp(s), I'd sell it and use my amp(s).
 
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Derrick111

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You have to be pretty self conscious not to accept that not everyone is into what you think is good. Sorry you can't handle that your computer is not enjoyed by everyone, but it's the facts. Why is it that some people can't handle that? Maybe it's the money you spent, or the feeling of a lack of cache that the gear you use is not admired by some? Get over it. I don't like the way they sound and do not find the sounds they tend to produce inspiring.
 

marshallmellowed

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You have to be pretty self conscious not to accept that not everyone is into what you think is good. Sorry you can't handle that your computer is not enjoyed by everyone, but it's the facts. Why is it that some people can't handle that? Maybe it's the money you spent, or the feeling of a lack of cache that the gear you use is not admired by some? Get over it. I don't like the way they sound and do not find the sounds they tend to produce inspiring.
Sorry, but it actually sounds like you might be the one that's "self conscious". You made, what appeared to be a blanket statement, that is simply not true, no facts behind it at all. I believe your statement was "they are poop. Uninspiring to play and often lifeless to listen to". I'll accept that that's "your opinion" (should have been stated as such), which is fine. I couldn't care less, who uses Fractal equipment (or any equipment). Tons of pro's out there using Fractal gear, whom I'm sure would also disagree with your statement. If it's not for you, then it's not for you.
 
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Derrick111

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No, to me they are poop. It's called an opinion. Quite different than a blanket statement. I'm saying "I THINK..." or "I FIND THAT...". That's what people put on forums. Jeez... never thought I'd be handing tissues to forum members on a Marshall amp page who were but hurt about someone saying they don't like playing through computers. OK, back to the original thread. This has played itself out.
 

tallcoolone

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All those blanket statements say is, “I have no clue what I’m talking about”. Internet experts
 

ichocobo

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In my humble opinion, you both are talking about different things. One thing is an axefx properly routed to FOH and to a power amp plus speaker, and on the other hand an amplitube (or badly configured axefx) going into low quality self powered monitors. I think there's a lot of grey areas between one side and the other that can lead to such blanket statements...
 

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