How much louder is a 50 or 100 watt JMP vs an SV20?

Manrey

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Many here only play at home, and at home an amp like the SV20 with no master can be overwhelming. Even at 5w. Personally if I am playing at those volume levels I prefer a good modeler but for those who want to play a real tube NMV amp at home that is the only real option.
I see that now, so the controls are different on SV20 than on the mini jubilee. I still haven't even heard mine yet, still waiting on the little 1x12 cab. My first Marshall. :uk:
 

tallcoolone

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I see that now, so the controls are different on SV20 than on the mini jubilee. I still haven't even heard mine yet, still waiting on the little 1x12 cab. My first Marshall. :uk:
Wait till you start accumulating cabs haha--nothing like having 6-7 choices lying around
 

1234_thumbwar

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But why use an attenuator if you can play the 20 at 5w? I just got a 2525h, can't wait for next band practice.
I like the sound of the amp attenuated at 20w vs playing it straight through the 5w setting.

I feel like I lose too much low end definition playing on the 5w setting. I put in 6CA7’s specifically to get some more low end articulation and the 5w setting kind of ruins that in this amp at least to my ears
 

Manrey

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It's all about finding your own tone right? I don't have a true attenuator. I do have the JHS little black amp box I can try. I recently got one of those pedals called "the button" from TubeDepot. It makes an SS amp sound pretty good at least at home. It has a tube inside. But for sure everything changes when you are playing live with a loud drummer and other guitars. Just when I think I am sounding good at home, then I learn the truth against that wall of sound. It's a been a journey.
 
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Manrey

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Wait till you start accumulating cabs haha--nothing like having 6-7 choices lying around
I am sure. And you really have a nice collection of amps. I am hoping to add an SV20H later. I love that this mini is so light and has the big valves.
 

1234_thumbwar

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It's all about finding your own tone right? I don't have a true attenuator. I do have the JHS little black amp box I can try. I recently got one of those pedals called "the button" from TubeDepot. It makes an SS amp sound pretty good at least at home. It has a tube inside. But for sure everything changes when you are playing live with a loud drummer and other guitars. Just when I think I am sounding good at home, then I learn the truth against that wall of sound. It's a been a journey.
I bought a cheap Weber I’m happy with for 150 or so. Doesn’t change the sound too much but I am gonna get a Freyette Power Station or something a bit more transparent than this at some point.

I’ve never tried “the button” but it sounds like it would be a pedal I’m into to boost my champ

Volume certainly makes these amps react differently than they do attenuated or set at a low volume. The better the attenuator the closer to the true sound but beating the snot out of a speaker can’t be faked or at least I don’t think it can
 

LoudStroud

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I’ve got a cheap Weber attenuator I bought used on the way for my SV20 as an emergency but I guess it’s only use now would be for an older bigger JMP when I come across one at a fair price. ‘70s JMPs used to be dirt cheap 2 years ago and now they just seem like they’re getting harder to find
Yes, with stage volumes having dropped over the years, digital modeling and the general mindset of current players (not a critical comment), I’m actually surprised there aren’t stacks of 70’s 50 & 100 watt Marshall heads in boneyards everywhere. There was a time not long ago when they were a dime a dozen in used aisles of guitar stores. But I guess they are becoming so collectible they’re being snatched up. There’s no getting around how great they sound. Plus the new ability to use high powered amps with cabinet modeling IR’s, like the UA OX and Two Notes boxes, allows more use of these heads. Not to mention the plethora of attenuators available now.
 

El Gringo

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Yes, with stage volumes having dropped over the years, digital modeling and the general mindset of current players (not a critical comment), I’m actually surprised there aren’t stacks of 70’s 50 & 100 watt Marshall heads in boneyards everywhere. There was a time not long ago when they were a dime a dozen in used aisles of guitar stores. But I guess they are becoming so collectible they’re being snatched up. There’s no getting around how great they sound. Plus the new ability to use high powered amps with cabinet modeling IR’s, like the UA OX and Two Notes boxes, allows more use of these heads. Not to mention the plethora of attenuators available now.
"There’s no getting around how great they sound " Summed it up pretty well right there .
 

GorgeousTones

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I know amplifier wattage, headroom, and volume are peculiar subjects to be objective about but I'm sure someone on this sub has two or three of these amps to compare. I've played through a couple 1959s before but never dimed like I can with my SV20. I know the SV20 is loud but I regularly get away with playing it at volume at home on 20 watts and I can even play with family in my apartment on the 5 watt setting.

I know good and well I'm not playing 50 or 100 watts at home dimed with or without family over because I have a 50 watt JCM 800 that will get me some noise complaints from neighbors with the master past 8 or so but I can play for as long as I can tolerate it at 5 or 6 on the volume and the gain as high or low as I like. I'm not typically the kind of player to crank a plexi so I wouldn't need to with a big one but I do wonder how much louder a jumpered 50 or 100w is compared to the 20w. Do the bigger ones just break up at a significantly louder volume because of the headroom? I've noticed that there's more bloom or room for each note to fill out the room on the 20 watt setting vs the 5 watt setting so would a bigger plexi just mean more bloom for lack of a better word? Having experience with a small plexi has stirred up some temptation to see what the bigger ones are all about. Especially if everything leads me towards a Superbass, 1986, or a Hail Mary with a JTM45/100 or JTM50

I also bought an attenuator shortly after getting my SV20 but I frankly haven't had a need for it yet. If I get a 50 watt JMP the attenuator will be good for it but 100 watts would melt the one I bought just in case anybody says I'm going to need one

Wattage is only part of the equation and can often be misleading in regards to both measured & perceived output volume. Sure a 200w Major is a significantly different animal compared with your SV20.. But you also really need to consider the type/design & number of your speakers among other factors to determine what kind of db levels you’ll be dealing with.
This may seem trivial but if you’ve ever had the opportunity to play a vintage Vox Ac30 or Ac15 you know those babies are LOUD! You wouldn’t expect a 15 watt Vox amplifier with a 2x12” cabinet loaded with Alnico Blues (speakers rated at 15 watt’s) to breathe fire.. But let me tell you, played side by side it’s shocking that a a vintage AC15 & a Fender Blues jr are both 15 watt el84 powered amps..
This is also why amps with the “half power” Pentode/Triode switches are so misleading. I don’t know if you’re familiar with the Egnater Amps Rebel, But one of its selling points for alot of people was the power/wattage control feature. I remember being curious so I tried one in a store, There was literally 100% Zero difference between the power control all the way down and completely maxed.
 

GorgeousTones

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Yes, with stage volumes having dropped over the years, digital modeling and the general mindset of current players (not a critical comment), I’m actually surprised there aren’t stacks of 70’s 50 & 100 watt Marshall heads in boneyards everywhere. There was a time not long ago when they were a dime a dozen in used aisles of guitar stores. But I guess they are becoming so collectible they’re being snatched up. There’s no getting around how great they sound. Plus the new ability to use high powered amps with cabinet modeling IR’s, like the UA OX and Two Notes boxes, allows more use of these heads. Not to mention the plethora of attenuators available now.
No kidding.. great point! Sure, the 100w Plexis are certainly coveted and valuable. But the only way those amps are being put to use these days is in isolation cabs or in a separate soundproofed room with mic’s for recording..
The big wattage Marshall’s haven’t gone the way of the dinosaur but Fender Twins certainly have, particularly the 120w Silverface ones. There’s literally piles of old Fender Twin Reverb’s piling up in stores in cities like Nashville where they were once treasured. The flagship premium model Fender amp is stacking up in boneyards while the “student” entry level practice models like the Champ, Princeton, And Deluxe are fetching bigger prices every day and are worth more than the Twin..
 

El Gringo

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No kidding.. great point! Sure, the 100w Plexis are certainly coveted and valuable. But the only way those amps are being put to use these days is in isolation cabs or in a separate soundproofed room with mic’s for recording..
The big wattage Marshall’s haven’t gone the way of the dinosaur but Fender Twins certainly have, particularly the 120w Silverface ones. There’s literally piles of old Fender Twin Reverb’s piling up in stores in cities like Nashville where they were once treasured. The flagship premium model Fender amp is stacking up in boneyards while the “student” entry level practice models like the Champ, Princeton, And Deluxe are fetching bigger prices every day and are worth more than the Twin..
No surprise there at all , as the king of cleans is biting the dust . The king of cleans was my very first amp which I still have at home collecting dust . Great tube driven spring reverb . Super heavy amp to haul around .
 

LoudStroud

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No kidding.. great point! Sure, the 100w Plexis are certainly coveted and valuable. But the only way those amps are being put to use these days is in isolation cabs or in a separate soundproofed room with mic’s for recording..
The big wattage Marshall’s haven’t gone the way of the dinosaur but Fender Twins certainly have, particularly the 120w Silverface ones. There’s literally piles of old Fender Twin Reverb’s piling up in stores in cities like Nashville where they were once treasured. The flagship premium model Fender amp is stacking up in boneyards while the “student” entry level practice models like the Champ, Princeton, And Deluxe are fetching bigger prices every day and are worth more than the Twin..
You’re right. Heck, even my Super Reverb, which I was my workhorse clean amp back in the day, sat around for over 15 years before I finally sold it. Bought a nice BF Vibrolux Reverb in recent years but barely gets used. But sure is hard to beat for recording. Otherwise never plug into anything louder than a Dlx Rvb.
 

El Gringo

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You’re right. Heck, even my Super Reverb, which I was my workhorse clean amp back in the day, sat around for over 15 years before I finally sold it. Bought a nice BF Vibrolux Reverb in recent years but barely gets used. But sure is hard to beat for recording. Otherwise never plug into anything louder than a Dlx Rvb.
Back in 2001 I got a hold of a 62 Fender Super Brown face with wheat grill cloth and talk about impulse purchase . Great tube driven tremolo , but never use it . Fender Super Reverb is truly a work horse amp that has been used by many on stage either in bars and clubs or bigger stages . I have told this before that when I first started playing in the mid 70's my very first amp was a vintage Black Face Twin that was an awesome amp . My Father brought it home one day from his Bouzoki playing buddy who had to go away for a stint and I also got a vintage script logo MXR Phase 90 , which I still use to this day . When his friend got out (Bless his Soul ) my Dad took the Black Face Twin away , but I got to keep the Phase 90 . At my Mom's funeral back in 2010 the same Gent came to pay his respects and I reminded him of the amp and pedal and Thanked him and all he did was just smiled . Really cool Family from Astoria NY with very gorgeous daughters who were in the Diner business .
 

scozz

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There is an interaction with the guitar and amp in the same room that there's no other way to get.
When recording, I always like to be in the same room as the amp. To get those little feed notes, making it sound more live.
This ^
 

tallcoolone

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I have to say, I was playing with the SC20 in a pretty loud room last weekend with the Vistalite kit and the amp could barely keep up through a 2x12. First time I didn't have FOH support and I could tell, but I think the SV is prob a little louder esp through a 4x12
 

dro

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I have to say, I was playing with the SC20 in a pretty loud room last weekend with the Vistalite kit and the amp could barely keep up through a 2x12. First time I didn't have FOH support and I could tell, but I think the SV is prob a little louder esp through a 4x12
I remember those Vistalite kits. My drummer had a blue one. He played the 24" kick with his hip and the ball of his foot. People complained about how loud he played for over 40 years.
He was loud on any kit he played on. I loved it.
 

Ufoscorpion

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Again as rule of thumb , double the watts = a 10% increase in volume , Roughly speaking a 1987 will be 10% louder than a SV and a 1959 will be 10% louder than a 1987 .
 

Biff Maloy

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I had the same experience with my SV20H and SV212 as Tall said. I could hear it but it had no ass or headroom left. I was even asked could i turn up a little. I mentioned this a while back. It didn't get much traction. Kind of hard to get that point across when it seems just about every SV owner attenuates it.

20 watts was new to me. It had been a while since I'd gotten out I admit but after getting primed at how loud they were supposed to be prior to purchasing once i got the rig and played with it I had my doubts although I liked the sound of the amp. My honest first thought was it wasn't near as loud as described.

Sold it and the 2525H rig and went back to a 50 watt. Absolutely no regrets.
 

tallcoolone

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I had the same experience with my SV20H and SV212 as Tall said. I could hear it but it had no ass or headroom left. I was even asked could i turn up a little. I mentioned this a while back. It didn't get much traction. Kind of hard to get that point across when it seems just about every SV owner attenuates it.

20 watts was new to me. It had been a while since I'd gotten out I admit but after getting primed at how loud they were supposed to be prior to purchasing once i got the rig and played with it I had my doubts although I liked the sound of the amp. My honest first thought was it wasn't near as loud as described.

Sold it and the 2525H rig and went back to a 50 watt. Absolutely no regrets.
See for me that situation is rare and when I'm in it again I agree I will bring something bigger. Most of the time I am running to the PA as well so that ass and headroom are supplemented there--I think these Studio amps are perfect for those situations.

Barely ever am I playing for anyone when I'm not going through a PA and 2 subs. But yeah, in a loud rock band in a loud room alone with no support the SC20 anyway can be a little underpowered.
 

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