Home recording chugging guitars

[Ralf_M.]

Hi,


I wounder what to buy (if not already at hand) for home recording chugging guitars in a rental flat, that doesn't result in neighbours with torches and pitchforks knocking on my door.


Maybe


Guitar -> [1] -> Marshall DSL1HR -> Marshall MX112R -> Shure SM57 -> Microphone Input Audio Interface


(it probably doesn't sound any better than an amp emulation)


or


Guitar -> [1] -> Marshall DSL20HR -> Marshall MX112R -> Shure SM57 -> Microphone Input Audio Interface


(it probably does sound as good as JCM 800 + a considerable 4 x 12" cab , but neighbours might knock on the door)


or


another amp, another cab, another microphone


or


some amp -> DI Box -> Line Input Audio Interface -> Impulse Response


or


anything else, amp from another vendor, but Marshall, no amp at all?


[1]
1. No FX
2. Ibanez TS9 Tube Screamer
3. Boss OD-2 TURBO OverDrive
4. Something else


Regards,
Ralf

 

[Mitchell Pearrow]

Hi,


I wounder what to buy (if not already at hand) for home recording chugging guitars in a rental flat, that doesn't result in neighbours with torches and pitchforks knocking on my door.


Maybe


Guitar -> [1] -> Marshall DSL1HR -> Marshall MX112R -> Shure SM57 -> Microphone Input Audio Interface


(it probably doesn't sound any better than an amp emulation)


or


Guitar -> [1] -> Marshall DSL20HR -> Marshall MX112R -> Shure SM57 -> Microphone Input Audio Interface


(it probably does sound as good as JCM 800 + a considerable 4 x 12" cab , but neighbours might knock on the door)


or


another amp, another cab, another microphone


or


some amp -> DI Box -> Line Input Audio Interface -> Impulse Response


or


anything else, amp from another vendor, but Marshall, no amp at all?


[1]
1. No FX
2. Ibanez TS9 Tube Screamer
3. Boss OD-2 TURBO OverDrive
4. Something else


Regards,
Ralf

Get the dsl it can behave at lower levels ,, I have the Dsl40c’s but the 20 hr will still do the job you are after

To The Forum

Cheers
Mitch

 

[ibmorjamn]

Honestly , I’m going to catch hell but the new EVH 5150 Iconic combo is incredible and I just played one for minutes . Given the price and what it does to all hell with anything else.

That being said , look at the blue guitar demo compared to a studio classic Marshall.
I use a Line 6 HX Stomp for recording . Ymmv
Welcome to the asylum.

 

[mcblink]

Hi,


I wounder what to buy (if not already at hand) for home recording chugging guitars in a rental flat, that doesn't result in neighbours with torches and pitchforks knocking on my door.


Maybe


Guitar -> [1] -> Marshall DSL1HR -> Marshall MX112R -> Shure SM57 -> Microphone Input Audio Interface


(it probably doesn't sound any better than an amp emulation)


or


Guitar -> [1] -> Marshall DSL20HR -> Marshall MX112R -> Shure SM57 -> Microphone Input Audio Interface


(it probably does sound as good as JCM 800 + a considerable 4 x 12" cab , but neighbours might knock on the door)


or


another amp, another cab, another microphone


or


some amp -> DI Box -> Line Input Audio Interface -> Impulse Response


or


anything else, amp from another vendor, but Marshall, no amp at all?


[1]
1. No FX
2. Ibanez TS9 Tube Screamer
3. Boss OD-2 TURBO OverDrive
4. Something else


Regards,
Ralf

Friedman JJ Jr.
It's totally capable of recording silently, directly from the amp and straight to the interface.

 

[Ralf_M.]

Thank you all for your input. I wonder if a Two Notes Torpedo Captor X might be useful?

Guitar -> with or without an overdrive stomp box -> Marshall DSL20HR -> Two Notes Torpedo Captor X 16 (or 8) -> Line Input Audio Interface

I can probably rule out the DSL1HR. However, a Studio Classic SC20H or a Friedman JJ-Junior without something like a Two Notes Torpedo Captor X are just about the price of a Marshall DSL20HR + a Two Notes Torpedo Captor X.

 

[mcblink]

Sounds like you may have answered your own question then.

 

[wakjob]

If you're hell bent on using tube amps at home, and still have volume/neighbor issues, you really need to get a reactive load box to run into a DAW/computer or re-amp with a separate power amp.

As much as I love my HX Stomp, the feel and experience of running my tubes amps with my Suhr RL box is still a bit better.

 

[Filipe Soares]

if you want to record without having the police in your door:

1) plugins.

2) get a loadbox and use IRs.

as a 3rd option you might use an isocab.

Currently I´m using option A and B, and for a long time I was into option C. but the IR quality vs. isocab hassles (price, tone, space etc) made me pursuing a different approach.

the main issue is: it´s not only about wattage, is all sound pressure levels. even a cranked DSL 1 will be loud enough to bother everyone around you. and to proper record guitars you will need to move some air, you need the cone moving... and when it moves, it gets loud.

So, because of that... plug a load box after your rig, use some nice IRs and record it using monitors or a headphone. as a purist, it might get you hurt, but it`s psychological. Believe me, I`ve been there.

 

[PelliX]

Many options outlined here. I'd go with a DSL, a cab and a Sure (SM57, SM58, pick your flavour). The emulated out on any Marshall is crap IMHO - a JJ or Blackstar (or most of everything else) will be better in that regard. That said, I love mic'ing amps. You end up with the sound on the recording that you have in the room - I like to work that way when possible. You don't have to turn a DSL up far to get good tone, they're very friendly amps in that respect. Also, whether you're sporting a 1x12 or a 4x12 makes little difference for your neighbors. Chances are you can make both go unreasonably loud with a 1 or 2W amp if you try hard....

 

[nickfox]

For recording, I really love my hx stomp. I ended up buying helix native for 100 dollars after I got the stomp. The helix native plugin makes recording so much easier and there is an enormous selection of great amp sounds. That and a good pair of headphones or monitors and you're set for apartment living.

 

[Eric'45]

The problem I see here, is that most Mics need a bit of loudness. When I record at Home, I use a Mic in front of a Cab, that's driven by a Tube Amp most of the Time. There's no doubt it's the best- sounding approach.
BUT, I live in a House, and have a dedicated Music Room. When you turn down your Amps, they still might sound good (most of the Amps mentioned here sound really good at low Volumes). If you try to record that really quiet Amp, with a standard Mic like a SM57, and especially if you do it in a smaller room, it is likely that the mic will pick up your Guitar picking Noises, or unwanted things like steps on the Floor, as loud as your Guitar tone.
I don't record at ear- splitting levels, but I found I need just a bit of Volume- and in a Flat that will almost certainly be too much. Microphones work different than the Human Ear.

The best *reasonably priced* Modeling Solution IMO is Bias FX2. You'll need an Interface with an Instrument Input to get the most out of it, but it does the Job. Of course there are Attenuation devices where you can plug a Tube Amp in, and use some sort of IR (=Impulse Response, a virtual Cabinet simulation). But the good ones are expensive. Most of the analog, simple line outs and speaker Emulations sound just terrible.

 

[Seventh Son]

I disagree with the above poster who said that the SM57 will pick up other sounds if you record quiet. The SM57 is very directional and records mostly what it is pointed at. In my experience with my DSL20HR and an MX112R, to get a good midrange and a pleasing top end with some saturation, it is necessary to drive the amp near or at maximum volume. Anything below 8 will give you a sound that comes mostly from the preamp, which will sound a bit harsh and thin on a recording (but great to your ears in the room), no matter how you EQ the amp.

I appreciate why many guys go the IR route, but I enjoy learning the art and the process as much as the end result, so I think the mic option is more rewarding in the long run and affords you more flexibility.

For recording only, I would go with a smaller amp, such as the DSL1 or DSL5. I can record loud during the day, when all my neighbors are at work. Maybe you could speak with your neighbors and figure out whether there's a time of the day that would work for all of them, so you have more discretion over your volume levels.

If you record modern metal, you may actually benefit from the preamp sound at lower volumes. I'll put it this way: To my ear, a Marshall driven at moderate levels sounds like a Mesa on a recording; a Marshall driven really hard (8–10) sounds like a Marshall on a recording. It depends on what your main target sound is. Do you have any examples of sounds that you like and would like to be able to approximate?

The DSLs sound great in the room.They sound great at any volume, from bedroom volume to super loud. Recording, however, is a different beast and may require some considerable volume to get close to what you want, depending on what you are after.

 

[Eric'45]

I disagree with the above poster who said that the SM57 will pick up other sounds if you record quiet.

You have a point here. I mostly work with the Sennheiser E906, which might be a bit more sensitive to sound sources behind the mic, since it's a supercardioid. It also depends on how sound sources are reflected in the Room, but it has definitely happened to me. Remember, the OP wants to play in a rental Flat, and that would require really quiet volumes. Even a Mic stand amplifying Floor noises could be a thing.

 

[Seventh Son]

You have a point here. I mostly work with the Sennheiser E906, which might be a bit more sensitive to sound sources behind the mic, since it's a supercardioid. It also depends on how sound sources are reflected in the Room, but it has definitely happened to me. Remember, the OP wants to play in a rental Flat, and that would require really quiet volumes. Even a Mic stand amplifying Floor noises could be a thing.

A supercardioid is even more directional than a cardioid and picks up less, not more, of sound behind it.

I think that issues like the mic picking up floor vibrations is a theoretical problem, but largely negligible in practice, especially for home- and hobby recordists. I wouldn’t worry about that. The most important thing is the source (i.e., the amp and the cab/speaker choice).

 

[Eric'45]

A supercardioid is even more directional than a cardioid and picks up less, not more, of sound behind it.

That is not true. It's actually one of the features one must be aware of- a Super- or Hypercardioid is less sensitive at Signals from the sides, but there's a spot in the opposite direction where it picks up sound sources.

If all that is important for home recording, is another matter.

The point is, that mic'ing Cabs in that situation will just lead to more problems.

 

[ibmorjamn]

Friedman JJ Jr.
It's totally capable of recording silently, directly from the amp and straight to the interface.

I hear good things about those , EL84 right?
I have EL84 covered with my EVH LBX.

 

[Ralf_M.]

Watching a you tube video isn't the same as playing a guitar by ourselves, so I won't claim that the BluGuitar Amp1 Iridium Edition can replace expensive and heavy weight iconic tube amps. My guess is, that the BluGuitar Amp1 Iridium Edition at least much likely is a very good solution to record chugging guitars at home, without upsetting the neighbours. The YouTube videos I've been listening to promise much more than just that.

 

[Michael Roe]

To get an amp, cab, mic, and audio interface it would run you around $1000 +/- most likely.
One of these will cost you $1099

FM3 – Amp Modeler – FX Processor – Fractal Audio Systems

www.fractalaudio.com

It is an audio interface as well and will sound better than any other way you try.
The only thing this will not do is the one thing you can not do anyhow....play loud with a real amp in the room.
A great modeler like the Fractal FM3 will get much better results than a single amp while trying to tame the volume.
Take it from a guy who has done everything you have suggested to all the above commenters suggestions.
If I were you I would get an FM3. Yes, it doesn't say "Marshall" on it and have real tubes but, I can swap the virtual JJ tubes for Mullard and it doesn't cost a dime but just a click of the mouse and sounds identical. Maybe I want to mod that amp? again....just a click of the mouse.
I shake my head at all these guys doing everything they can to record or listen to an amp at apartment or bedroom levels. If they only tried a Fractal out they would understand how much tone and time they are wasting.
Yes, they are that good and better than you think.....by far!

 

[Solid State]

Yeah, I'd go with the Fractal.

 

[mcblink]

I hear good things about those , EL84 right?
I have EL84 covered with my EVH LBX.

Absolutely dude!
I have had mine for a bit over a year, sounds huge for 84s. I have some recordings of it if you're interested in hearing. Actually, you may have already, as I've posted them here and there