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Discussion in 'The Tone Zone' started by Vinsanitizer, Sep 14, 2021.

  1. Vinsanitizer

    Vinsanitizer ✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴ ✴- - - - - TEH - - - - -✴ ✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴ Double Platinum Supporting Member VIP Member

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    In your opinion and/or experience, and in simple terms, how would you describe the tonal change of guitar speakers as they "break in"? Maybe in terms of bass, mids, treble - stuff like that like that.

    I got a newer combo map with low miles on it. Recently I was changing preamp tubes around and finally settled on an old set of MESA Russian 2's and a Groove Tubes matched phase inverter. I like the tone so I started cranking the amp up and the tone has been changing quickly to where it's sounding really thick in the top end and has nice fat mids and tight lows. When I first got it, it sounded brighter.

    Could also be the EL84 power tubes too, especially as I've been cranking the map up louder.

    I don't know. Trying to pin it down so I can understand what's changed/changing. Either way it's sounding great.

    .
     
  2. PelliX

    PelliX Well-Known Member

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    We (English speakers, at least), lack the correct vocabulary to aptly describe the changes, but losing a bit of 'high end thinness' and the mid/low coming to life are roughly what I've witnessed from breaking in speakers. The good ones that is. My Seventy/80's went from 'shrill ugly' to 'squeaky dull ugly' - if that makes any sense at all. :)

    You mean wear and tear or just 'when playing louder'? What kind of time span are we talking about?
     
  3. saxon68

    saxon68 Well-Known Member

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    “changing quickly to where it's sounding really thick in the top end and has nice fat mids and tight lows.”

    this exactly is what I’ve found when speakers break in. I’ve put amps/cabs face down on pillows and played some hip-hop music though them at loud levels to hasten the break-in.
     
  4. Vinsanitizer

    Vinsanitizer ✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴ ✴- - - - - TEH - - - - -✴ ✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴ Double Platinum Supporting Member VIP Member

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    It's a little 15 watter combo: 2 x EL83's and 3 x 12AX7's and a 12" Seventy/80 Celestion. It's only for jerking around at home. Specifically, my man shack. I've only needed to have it up to 3 on the master. But after changing the tubes around 2 weeks ago I've started to crank it towards 5 and above, and every other day when I turn it on the tone seems to be thicker so that I'm adding treble (and I usually hate treble). Only way I can describe it is it went from a good hamburger patty, to a nice thick juicy steakburger. Controlled feedback like crazy and lots of overtones and all the good stuff. So I guess by "suddenly", I mean more like over the last 2 weeks where it never did that before. Something's been changing, tubes or speakers.

    Here's a web pic - it's one of those FisherPrice things. (Those aren't my settings):


    Update: "MonoPrice":

    [​IMG]

    .
     
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2021
  5. Old Punker

    Old Punker Well-Known Member

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    How old are the MESA Russian 2's? They came stock in an amp I bought back in 2007 but I haven't encountered any since. Mine sounded great until a couple of years ago, I also kept turning up the treble in the last couple of months. After I put in new preamp tubes I had to back the treble way down. IDK maybe what you're hearing is these Russians in their final days of life?

    [​IMG]
     
  6. Vinsanitizer

    Vinsanitizer ✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴ ✴- - - - - TEH - - - - -✴ ✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴ Double Platinum Supporting Member VIP Member

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    LOL! Yeah they were probably around 2007, but maybe even before that. One's a black label and the other's a white label. Otherwise, identical. I wonder what they were rebrands of - Sovtek probably?

    .
     
  7. Old Punker

    Old Punker Well-Known Member

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    AFAIK the Russian 2's are rebranded Electro-Harmonix. That's what I replaced mine with and sounds way better in V1 and V2 of my Express 5:50 than the stock Mesa 12AX7's available now.
     
  8. Vinsanitizer

    Vinsanitizer ✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴ ✴- - - - - TEH - - - - -✴ ✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴ Double Platinum Supporting Member VIP Member

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    Good to know. Maybe I'll try new ones and see how they compare. Thanks. :yesway:
     
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  9. ricksdisconnected

    ricksdisconnected Well-Known Member

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  10. PelliX

    PelliX Well-Known Member

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    Oh look, the ancient art of Irish yoga.

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Sep 15, 2021
  11. SkyMonkey

    SkyMonkey Well-Known Member

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    Sure they aren't vodka bottles!
    vodka_aiv3.jpg
    59db86a920575.jpg
     
    Last edited: Sep 15, 2021
  12. GregM

    GregM Well-Known Member

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    Is the amp getting dirtier as you get louder?
    70 80s are pigs, but like all pigs they love the dirt
     
  13. Vinsanitizer

    Vinsanitizer ✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴ ✴- - - - - TEH - - - - -✴ ✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴ Double Platinum Supporting Member VIP Member

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    No. The speaker is rated at 80 watts, the amp maxes out at only 15 and I haven't run it above 7.
     
  14. GregM

    GregM Well-Known Member

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    I meant the tubes not the speaker, sorry I should have been specific.
     
  15. Vinsanitizer

    Vinsanitizer ✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴ ✴- - - - - TEH - - - - -✴ ✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴ Double Platinum Supporting Member VIP Member

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    Yeah. I'm thinking it's the tubes fattening up as I turn it up. Nothing's really distorting except the preamp.
     
  16. PelliX

    PelliX Well-Known Member

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    Try that amp with another speaker and love it so much more. Thank me later. :thumb:
     
  17. Vinsanitizer

    Vinsanitizer ✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴ ✴- - - - - TEH - - - - -✴ ✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴ Double Platinum Supporting Member VIP Member

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    I did. I tried it with my mini Marshall cab with Celestion's 10" version of a V30. It sounds great too, but I think the stock Seventy/80 is more suitable for it. That's the same speaker that comes stock with Marshall's DSL40.

    The stock speaker sucked more than any speaker has ever sucked before. So I shoved a Celestion G 10 Vintage innit:

    [​IMG]

    Is it still not clear that I like the amp and have no issues with it?

    .
     
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  18. PelliX

    PelliX Well-Known Member

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    No harm in trying to make it even better, right? :)

    No, the DSL20CR comes with a Seventy/80, the DSL40CR has a V30, if I remember correctly. Whatever works for you, though. :thumb:
     
  19. Vinsanitizer

    Vinsanitizer ✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴ ✴- - - - - TEH - - - - -✴ ✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴✴ Double Platinum Supporting Member VIP Member

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    The DSL40 does not come stock with a V30. They originally came stock with a Celestion Seventy/80 (at least until 2015*). It appears that they now come with a Celestion V-Type. The 70/80 was not a good speaker for that amp. Mine was one of the worst sounding Marshalls I ever owned, and rather than throw a hundred bucks for a new speaker at a new amp (especially a non-UK model), I just dumped it and never looked back. That combo is morbidly obese and JCM 2000's aren't the "Marshall" sound for me, as much as I've tried.

    *https://www.sevenstring.org/threads/speaker-upgrade-and-mods-dsl40c.274929/ (first paragraph).

    and

    upload_2021-9-20_3-29-31.png

    But again, I don't have any issues with the amp in my OP, specifically the stock 70/80. I was only asking for the source of the improvement in tone that I have been experiencing with use.

    .
     
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2021
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  20. PelliX

    PelliX Well-Known Member

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    Fair call - after all, you did not specify C or CR, I sort of assumed the CR - my bad. When I bought my 20CR, I somehow got over the 'Seventy/80 in there', the potential was there, and I figured some Green/Creamback juice would do the trick, and it did for me. I tried the speaker later on in a closed back cab, but it didn't sound much better to me. If you want another one to compliment it or a spare, I've still not managed to get rid of that one yet - you're welcome. :thumb:
     
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