Digitech Rp1000 4-cable Method. The Pros, Cons And Hope For Solutions

DreamTommy

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Hi All,


I ordered the Digitech RP1000 for testing. After over two weeks, I love the unit. The signal to noise level is very good and the quality and variety of effects are very good as well!

It took some back and forth with tech support to address concerns that I was obsessing about, but Digitech support was excellent! In fact, it was by route of real-time chat sessions that were accessible whenever I had a question and I had a personal e-mail address for conversing. Quality tech support is a-typical for most manufacturers today!

As noted, the RP1000 sound and effects quality is very good, but what sold me, is the fact that this unit is a switching system, that lets me use the 4-cable method. I found it integrated well with my DSL40C and 412 Cabinet. Tech support told me that they wanted to build a system that could integrate into an existing system, rather than replace it and I concur! Well done Digitech. I wanted my core tone to shine, and this device compliments it nicely!

Though I am mainly bypassing Amp/Cabinet mods and using my core sound, I hear a lot of good tones from the Amp/Cab mods, so I may be implementing some of them too.

The biggest downside initially to the RP 1000 from the factory, was level between the RP, it's loops and my Marshall amplifier. In essence, we are talking about gain stages! Remember, you have the amp preamp stage, the power amp stage, and the RP preset and master volume stages, so you have to really work at balancing it all out. It doesn't take long, and you can use the same technique for each of the presets. Plus, you can find tutorials on YouTube.

I did find 1 big issue to be aware of and that is if you deselect a preset, meaning turn it off, you go into BYPASS mode, where your true amp sound is heard. The concept of a BYPASS switch is wonderful, but please read on...

The "Good" BYPASS scenario: If prior to deselecting a preset, thus entering BYPASS mode, and the RP's Amp Loop button is selected (meaning you are including your amp preamp with the 4-Cable method in the RP signal chain), you can adjust all volume levels completely between your Amplifier and the RP's volume.

The "Bad" BYPASS scenario: This could be a big problem! If you have Amp Loop off on the RP, like perhaps when you want to use the RPs Amp/Cab Mods and avoid stacking pre-amps (meaning going direct to your amplifier power-amp), and you deselect a pre-set (meaning you are bypassing the RP), you will hear 100% of your power amp volume. In this scenario, the RP is going direct into your Amplifier's power amp section and you have NO control over levels. This could be dangerous!

Because the actual RP Bypass function has no volume adjustment, If you accidentally de-select a preset when using the RP Amp Loop in the off position, you may blow out somebody's ears because the amplifier may be too loud.

I don't have a solution for this! If anybody has a work around, or an idea how to manage BYPASS volume when Amp Loop is off, I'd love feedback! I don't necessarily foresee this being an issue, but in the heat and excitement of a big gig, and if you are not experienced or seasoned with the RP, you could accidentally deselect a pre-set and cause damage to your speakers or your ears. Furthermore, when Amp Loop is off, having the ability to attenuate the volume going to your power-amp would be a perfect solution!
 
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Matt_Krush

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I had the rp1000 for a few years...
I too didn't use the modeling section...I eventually sold it and went back to the rack.

Quicker setup, more versatility with lead patches, the rack changes head channels, and I don't have the core processor for my leads on the floor where stuff gets spilled.

It sounded good though....I just hate using 4 cables plus the power cord and having a system I only used half of.
 

MonstersOfTheMidway

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I never owned the RP1000 (I've used it many times and like it for some things), but I do have a little RP250 that I like and still use from time to time. I tried using the RP250 for gigs, but it was not very flexible in it's functionality and I had to compromise too much. Now, I just save it for recording, because the preamps, distortion, cab models, and effects are pretty good. For performance, I kill the preamps, cabs, and distortion so that I'm only using some effects (basically the Whammy, couple of reverbs, and acoustic simulator). Bypass is a bitch because I have to press two footswitches simultaneously, but if I don't press the two footswitches perfectly, the system goes to the next preset instead. Rather than attempt a delicate bypass, I just reserve an empty preset slot after or before the one I'm using so that it has the sound of being "bypassed."

Thankfully, I don't need to rely on my RP250 so much anymore, but it gets used from time to time to fulfill a limited but specific purpose.
 

ricksteruk

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Hey Tommy. Aha so you went with the RP1000. It's very much like the GSP1101 I used to use - it was a good sounding unit - I think the only major difference between them sound wise is that the GSP has 2 of the DSP chips in it so it can do preset spillover, whereas the RP1000 just has the one.

Getting the levels right in 4cm can actually be more of a challenge than you might expect. I'd try to set it up so that the bypass level is the same as the levels of your presets... I guess that means you need to turn up your presets?
 

DreamTommy

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Hi Rick, I was going to send you a message to update you, but you found the info! Hope you are well! I did go with the RP. The big issue for me is The "Bad" BYPASS scenario noted in the beginning of this thread. I can get unity gain between everything, except when Amp Loop is off on the RP. When it's off, the RPs BYPASS directs the signal straight to the Power Amp. Though I would never use the Bypass when Amp Loop is off (because it doesn't hit the preamp and controls of the dsl40c), if you accidentally deselect a preset, you get BYPASS and 100% volume of your power amp. Not good! What I was wondering, is what about adding a volume attenuator in the effects loop, and reduce the volume of the power amp and then go back and re-do unity gain/ leveling again. Do you think that's crazy? Any other ideas? Bypass works great when Amp Loop is on, because I have the controls on the front of the amp to adjust!
 

ricksteruk

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I'm just wondering what you mean when you say you get 100% of the volume of your power amp?

Doesn't the DSL's master volume still work when the RP goes into bypass? Is it set at 10?

I had a similar problem to what you describe using 4cm with my old 4210 combo because the amps FX loop is post Master Volume, so as you're describing you literally dcid get full 100% signal into the power amp if you hit bypass on the FX unit... and yes one solution I had for this was to put a volume pedal after the FX unit - which became the actual master volume for the system.
 

DreamTommy

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The RP1000 with 4 cable method, can switch between going to the power amp or going through the input. When using models on rp, it's best to go directly to power amp. When I do that, bypass gives me 100 % volume. When I bypass when I'm using my amp input or preamp stage, I can adjust the volume.

QUOTE="ricksteruk, post: 1513577, member: 43305"]I'm just wondering what you mean when you say you get 100% of the volume of your power amp?

Doesn't the DSL's master volume still work when the RP goes into bypass? Is it set at 10?

I had a similar problem to what you describe using 4cm with my old 4210 combo because the amps FX loop is post Master Volume, so as you're describing you literally dcid get full 100% signal into the power amp if you hit bypass on the FX unit... and yes one solution I had for this was to put a volume pedal after the FX unit - which became the actual master volume for the system.[/QUOTE]
 

DreamTommy

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The master volume does not work when using the direct to power amp method.

OTE="DreamTommy, post: 1513613, member: 48830"]The RP1000 with 4 cable method, can switch between going to the power amp or going through the input. When using models on rp, it's best to go directly to power amp. When I do that, bypass gives me 100 % volume. When I bypass when I'm using my amp input or preamp stage, I can adjust the volume.

QUOTE="ricksteruk, post: 1513577, member: 43305"]I'm just wondering what you mean when you say you get 100% of the volume of your power amp?

Doesn't the DSL's master volume still work when the RP goes into bypass? Is it set at 10?

I had a similar problem to what you describe using 4cm with my old 4210 combo because the amps FX loop is post Master Volume, so as you're describing you literally dcid get full 100% signal into the power amp if you hit bypass on the FX unit... and yes one solution I had for this was to put a volume pedal after the FX unit - which became the actual master volume for the system.[/QUOTE][/QUOTE]
 

wakjob

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Sounds to me like all your presets are attenuating the amps volumes.
So when you bypass its too loud.

Jack up all your preset volumes and turn your amp down.
 

ricksteruk

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When I say "The Master Volume" - I am referring to your DSL40c Master Volume - that should still work right?

I agree with Wakjob - you probably need to turn up all your preset volumes.
 

wakjob

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Wait a minute. I get it.

I just happen to have a DSL100 here for repair. I plugged directly into the Return and see what you're saying. The Channel and/or Master volumes don't control the overall level of the amp.

So if there's no level control for the bypassed signal coming out of the rp1000... yer fecked.

And I suppose the rp's "To Amp Input" jack is were the signal is coming from when in bypass?
 

ricksteruk

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OK! Of course!! There is no actual "Master Volume" control on the DSL.
SORRY - my mistake - I should have checked the DSL control panel.
There is only a volume for each channel separately.

Yeah the solution as you said before is to put a volume control in between the RP1000 and the DSL's FX return.

Like this: (about $45)
JHS-Lil-Black-ampbox-top.jpg

https://www.jhspedals.com/products/guitar-pedals/little-black-amp-box/

Or you can make one for a few dollars.. it's just a box, two jack sockets and a volume pot.
 
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DreamTommy

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You guys.... thanks. Everything works perfect and levels are all balanced, with the exception of when I use bypass and the rp is directly switched to direct to power amp. I think I will take the advice, make or buy a volume knob box, insert from rp to effects return on marshall and go back and adjust all presets and amp settings for correct leveling/ gain staging. You guys are awesome. Thanks again. Tommy
 
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DreamTommy

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OK! Of course!! There is no actual "Master Volume" control on the DSL.
SORRY - my mistake - I should have checked the DSL control panel.
There is only a volume for each channel separately.

Yeah the solution as you said before is to put a volume control in between the RP1000 and the DSL's FX return.

Like this: (about $45)
JHS-Lil-Black-ampbox-top.jpg

https://www.jhspedals.com/products/guitar-pedals/little-black-amp-box/

Or you can make one for a few dollars.. it's just a box, two jack sockets and a volume pot.


Hello Rick, I ordered this device. It is clean looking, nice and small and seemingly well-made. When it comes, I will try it out and keep you posted! Take care!
 

DreamTommy

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OK! Of course!! There is no actual "Master Volume" control on the DSL.
SORRY - my mistake - I should have checked the DSL control panel.
There is only a volume for each channel separately.

Yeah the solution as you said before is to put a volume control in between the RP1000 and the DSL's FX return.

Like this: (about $45)
JHS-Lil-Black-ampbox-top.jpg

https://www.jhspedals.com/products/guitar-pedals/little-black-amp-box/

Or you can make one for a few dollars.. it's just a box, two jack sockets and a volume pot.

Hi Rick, I ordered this unit, and it arrived. I put it on the effects return after the Digitech RP1000, and set unity gain again (Remember that my issue was when you hit bypass when amp loop is off on the RP, you get full volume of the Marshall DSL40C). Wow. I was also able to crank my channel volume up and get more "TUBE" and control all levels with the RP1000 switching system. I am very happy! Thanks again... Tommy
 

ricksteruk

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No problem Tommy! Glad it's solved your problem :) as I said I did the same thing using an old Boss volume pedal with my old 4210 - and yeah it does mean you can properly drive the preamp section now.
 

tmingle

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I have the DSL40C and the RP-1000 as well. Since the DSL40C has independent volumes for each channel, the FX loop is located after the volume controls. Anything inserted into the FX return will be amplified at full power.
 

DreamTommy

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I have the DSL40C and the RP-1000 as well. Since the DSL40C has independent volumes for each channel, the FX loop is located after the volume controls. Anything inserted into the FX return will be amplified at full power.
Hi, I bought this unit: https://www.jhspedals.com/products/guitar-pedals/little-black-amp-box/ and stuck it as the last item in the loop to the effects return, and I now have a master volume. After going back, and re-adjusting levels in presets on the Digitech RP1000, I was able to achieve unity gain across the board. This unit did the trick!
 

RHAM

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Hi, I made one by myself. Easy, cheap and very useful !

Hi Rick, I ordered this unit, and it arrived. I put it on the effects return after the Digitech RP1000, and set unity gain again (Remember that my issue was when you hit bypass when amp loop is off on the RP, you get full volume of the Marshall DSL40C). Wow. I was also able to crank my channel volume up and get more "TUBE" and control all levels with the RP1000 switching system. I am very happy! Thanks again... Tommy
 


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