'70, 1960B, Refurb And/Or Sell?

Gene Ballzz

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Hey Folks,
I have a bit of a conundrum. I've got a '70. 1960B cabinet in need of some TLC. I also need to thin my herd.

IMG_1949 copy.jpg

PROS:
> It has all the original metal handles and top caster cups.
> Has original cloth with the damage shown.
> Original plywood back panel with original metal jack cup.
> What appears to be original logo, still intact.
> Speakers are:
>>>> Three Pre-Rola G12M-25/75hz, T1221, with all date codes surrounding CC17 (March 17, 1970), two have what I gues to be small screwdriver style pokes near the surround, but sound fabulous! Given the range of date codes, I guess them to be original to the cabinet
>>>> One withPre-Rola G12M-25/75hz, T1511, basket/frame, date code I can't current read, but I recall looking closely a while back and determining it to be the same year. It has been infected with a waldom re-cone and sounds like it.

CONS:
> All the original red tolex was removed long, long ago (scraps still visible, attached inside) and painted black.
> All four finger joint corners are loose, but the fingers are still intact.
> The bottom appears to have never had casters installed, but with no feet, it has lost about 1/16 of an inch, or so at it's deepest spots, from being dragged around!
> A number of small dings and chips that need to be repaired with filler, before new tolex.

I really need to sell this and see several ways to go.
>> Offer it "as is" with suggestions on refurb repairs and leave the decisions of the details up to the new owner.
>> Go ahead and:
>>>> Push the corners apart to re-glue.
>>>> Make a secure "dam" around the bottom and fill the whole area with thin epoxy to build it back to proper thickness, and properly rout it to match.
>>>> Re-tolex and leave the original grill cloth and logo.
>>>> Have the Waldom cone speaker, refurbed as best possible by Jim @Scumback Speakers

I think I'd prefer to entertain offers "as is" and be willing to properly pack and ship it, anywhere in the continental Used To Be United States! I have no idea what the real value is, or what to ask, ergo the desire to entertain offers. I'm thinking that all the labor and expense of the repairs may not net me much more than those expenses, if that? More pics can be available and any advice would be sincerely appreciated.

Just Thankin'
Gene
 
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pulsonicsound

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That certainly looks cool!

A few hours work and that’ll be good as new, however if your trying to thin the herd it might just be better to just glue the corners and sell it as is!
 

Gene Ballzz

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That certainly looks cool!

A few hours work and that’ll be good as new, however if your trying to thin the herd it might just be better to just glue the corners and sell it as is!

Yeah, I'm thinking at least have that Waldom misfit re-coned as a T1221 and broken in by Jim @Scumback Speakers and re-glue the cab corners. Then share the honest provenance with prospective buyers? While that Waldom doesn't totally ruin the sound of the cabinet, it sure does sound hideous on it's own, by comparison. The cabinet really does "wake up & come alive" with even a recent UK made version of the same greenback, in place of the Waldom! Its about the same $$$ to either sell it with the UK re-issue and give the buyer the Waldom to do as he likes (but that's dumping 5 speakers instead of four), or making the Waldom mo' betta thru reconing. While contemplating the fate of the cabinet, I've been gloriously using a couple of the vintage ones in various lower watt combos.

Does anyone have any ideas on a fair asking price, with the Scumback recone for one of the speakers? Or make me an offer?
Thanks Folks,
Gene
 

Matthews Guitars

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I'm sure it's out of my budget. But definitely, if the glue joints have failed, it needs to be taken apart and reglued. It's not a tough job to do that. Not with the tolex already off it.

I'd say that has to be done for structural integrity reasons and at high volume it probably rattles due to the loose joinery. If it doesn't now, it will eventually.

Some people would otherwise just leave it as it is. But there would be no sin in recovering it. Not with the original tolex all gone already.

I'd probably keep the grill just as it is, and then recover it in the original red and, this is kind of odd for me to say it, I'd then "distress" the new tolex to match its condition to the grill. It'd look wrong with pristine tolex and that grill together.
 

Gene Ballzz

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I'm sure it's out of my budget. But definitely, if the glue joints have failed, it needs to be taken apart and reglued. It's not a tough job to do that. Not with the tolex already off it.

I'd say that has to be done for structural integrity reasons and at high volume it probably rattles due to the loose joinery. If it doesn't now, it will eventually.

Some people would otherwise just leave it as it is. But there would be no sin in recovering it. Not with the original tolex all gone already.

I'd probably keep the grill just as it is, and then recover it in the original red and, this is kind of odd for me to say it, I'd then "distress" the new tolex to match its condition to the grill. It'd look wrong with pristine tolex and that grill together.

That's just about what I'd do to keep it. In my current "liquidation" mode, I think I'll leave those judgement calls to the new owner and simply re-glue and get that Waldom abomination re-coned! And as far as your budget, don't be ashamed to shoot me a PM offer, as I'm really difficult to offend and I may take less than you think! I'm aware of the shipping costs and will somewhat factor that into what I'll accept! For the right reasonable number, I'd even let it go, not re-glued and leaving what to do with the fourth Waldom up to the buyer and consider that in the acceptable $$$!

I'm figurin, re-glued, with the Scumback recone, it may be worth in the +/- 1K range. But that's 6 or more hours labor (complete disassemble, re-glue and fully reassemble) and +$200 for the recone job, so you can do the math! I'm also figuring the three original and great sounding speakers are likely worth +/- $300 each?

Thanks For Thinkin'
Gene
 

Matthews Guitars

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If I hadn't just dropped 550 bucks into a modern 1960B cabinet a few weeks ago, I'd be sending you a PM right now! Funny how that works.

Well...it's not like I wouldn't be able to resell the B cabinet for about what I have into it...maybe even more as I could include the reissue Greenbacks that I just put into it. Let me grind on that idea for a bit.

I'd definitely recone the Waldom recone. I got four of those and they were awful. I sent them off to Scumback and they reconed them with reissue T1221 cones, and one frame had to be rebuilt due to a slipped magnet. It all came out great and the speakers don't sound much different than the only original Pulsonic Greenback I currently own. So I could put that one Pulsonic Greenback with your three originals, and that'd be a box of happiness right there.

As for shipping, check with local music stores. They usually have some cheap shipping arrangement, often with fedex. If they have a 4x12 shipping box in their storage room, then that pretty much has the shipping issue solved, and at reasonable price.

I know the owners of a few music stores and they ALL keep an assortment of boxes for all occasions up to and including reshipping 4x12s.
 

fitz288

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I'm figurin, re-glued, with the Scumback recone, it may be worth in the +/- 1K range. But that's 6 or more hours labor (complete disassemble, re-glue and fully reassemble) and +$200 for the recone job, so you can do the math! I'm also figuring the three original and great sounding speakers are likely worth +/- $300 each?
I'd bet you'll never recoup any investment in time or repairs.
If you don't want to keep it, sell it exactly "as-is".
Full disclosure, but let the buyer decide what to fix and how.
If they want it restored, to whatever the degree, it can be entirely their decision.
 

Gene Ballzz

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One big question I have is whether or not my ballpark pricing assumptions are even in the actual ballpark? Is it too high, or am I selling myself short? I'm an old fart with a diagnosed "toes up" date of 1.5-2.5 years and want to buy and enjoy a bunch of new toys before I go! While "lightening my load" (for myself and heirs) is key, expedience and maximizing $$$ for toys is pretty cool too!
Thanks For The Thoughts,
Gene
 

Seanxk

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It would have been fitted with the revvo flat plate casters which had 3 fixing points with 2Ba screws, very difficult to spot if it's been dragged around as the holes will soon block up. but they'll be there.
 

pulsonicsound

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the original grill cloth and original speakers are great selling points, I wouldn't bother reconing the speaker thats been reconed, if you sell it let the new owner worry about that, while a recone will probably sound better, its not going to have a massive impact on the value.

price wise

a matched pair of pulsonic coned marshall spec greenbacks from 1970 are worth at least $1000 by themselves, I'd price accordingly

hope that helps
 

pedecamp

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That's just about what I'd do to keep it. In my current "liquidation" mode, I think I'll leave those judgement calls to the new owner and simply re-glue and get that Waldom abomination re-coned! And as far as your budget, don't be ashamed to shoot me a PM offer, as I'm really difficult to offend and I may take less than you think! I'm aware of the shipping costs and will somewhat factor that into what I'll accept! For the right reasonable number, I'd even let it go, not re-glued and leaving what to do with the fourth Waldom up to the buyer and consider that in the acceptable $$$!

I'm figurin, re-glued, with the Scumback recone, it may be worth in the +/- 1K range. But that's 6 or more hours labor (complete disassemble, re-glue and fully reassemble) and +$200 for the recone job, so you can do the math! I'm also figuring the three original and great sounding speakers are likely worth +/- $300 each?

Thanks For Thinkin'
Gene
Dont fix anything, not even the speaker, bundle the speakers for sale with a "free" cab that needs refurbish. Offer to fix the 4th speaker for an upcharge if the buyer wants you to.
 
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Matthews Guitars

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What's the value of a Pulsonic coned Greenback in good condition these days? Not sure, but I got lucky and scored one for just 100 dollars a few months ago. I know that was a screaming deal.

I'm comfortable with spending up to 350 for one that is original but may have some repaired damage to the cone, so that sets a low end price range for a Greenback based on past selling history on Reverb and eBay.

But a thousand each? I don't agree with that valuation. Maybe some people would pay that, but it's too rich for my blood.

Ultimately, the tonal difference between a broken in GB reissue and an original is not so big that I'd pay such a large premium to get it.

I keep having to remind even myself, that the people who care most about the nuances of guitar tone are the players, and only the players. The audience doesn't, except for the other guitar players who are all standing in the front row with their arms crossed, giving the "You'd better play awesome, man, or I want my money back!" vibe.

I'm going to go bet on the Preakness this evening. Maybe if I make the right bet I'll be able to strike a deal for this cabinet!
 

pulsonicsound

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What's the value of a Pulsonic coned Greenback in good condition these days? Not sure, but I got lucky and scored one for just 100 dollars a few months ago. I know that was a screaming deal.

I'm comfortable with spending up to 350 for one that is original but may have some repaired damage to the cone, so that sets a low end price range for a Greenback based on past selling history on Reverb and eBay.

But a thousand each? I don't agree with that valuation. Maybe some people would pay that, but it's too rich for my blood.

Ultimately, the tonal difference between a broken in GB reissue and an original is not so big that I'd pay such a large premium to get it.

I keep having to remind even myself, that the people who care most about the nuances of guitar tone are the players, and only the players. The audience doesn't, except for the other guitar players who are all standing in the front row with their arms crossed, giving the "You'd better play awesome, man, or I want my money back!" vibe.

I'm going to go bet on the Preakness this evening. Maybe if I make the right bet I'll be able to strike a deal for this cabinet!
a matched pair with no issues from 1970 is worth that, the last pair of t1221's I sold from 1969 went for £900 which is roughly 1130usd, obviously non matched, non marshall spec stuff goes for a lot less but their really isn't that many of these left that come up for sale in decent condition!
 

ricksdisconnected

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hey geeze, try selling it with offer to restore it or repair it. i they see
your other "crafty work" they might jump on it or at least see you
more than capable to work magic.
 


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