POLL PLEASE Marshall badge important to you?

Discussion in 'Marshall Amps' started by NewReligion, Oct 30, 2019.

?

Would you prefer a $1400 Marshall + $475 & up OR less expensive Clone

  1. Marshall $1400 + $475 + PayPal/Reverb fee 7% $132

    51.4%
  2. Quality Clone $800 + $475 + PayPal/Reverb fee %7 $89

    48.6%
  1. NewReligion

    NewReligion Well-Known Member VIP Member

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    Hello everyone. Please take time to read and vote as I am exploring how to produce great tone and passing savings on to you. Thank you.

    I work as a hobbyist. It has been my experience that most guitarists wish to have the “Marshall” badge on their amplifier.

    With the current inflated costs of stock Marshall’s & fees in addition to the introduction of online State sales tax, commerce is becoming somewhat expensive now that online sales have destroyed malls within Americas capitalistic society.

    Cameron, Friedman, Gower, Fortin & VooDoo all charge $800-$1000 for a significant single channel overhaul mod to your amplifier.

    I keep my mods reasonable at $475. The addition of a Metropoulos zero Loss Effects loop is only $175. A silent foot switchable second clean channel is only $250

    To the point:
    How much interest would there be for me to offer my Pandora Mod which is relative to Friedman's HBE/BE with the saturation clipper but MUCH more OPEN & Marshall-ish at my rate of $475. Other mods offered are a True Jose High Gain or Cameron/Bogner “Cantrell” or Modern Mod with Tone Stack choices on any Marshall Clone type circuit platform whether it be Metropoulos, Red Plate, Granger, Ceriatone, Mojo-Tone etc. at a less expensive final cost due to Marshall’s recent inflation.

    It should be noted that all of these circuit overhaul mods may be accomplished in addition on Sovtek, Traynor YBA-1, Laney AOR, Jet City Friedman PT-20, Smalbox 50, Fender Bassman, Rockitt Retro & others.

    This would allow me to pass the savings onto the consumer. And these would be serious savings, (hundreds of dollars) as all I do is add the cost of my work on top of what I had to pay for the donor amp. I also must pass on any Reverb and/or PayPal
    fee’s.

    As I am always honest a couple of these manufacturers have better transformers. As I recall RedPlate & Metropoulos are but only 2 that I can recall.

    Please take part of the poll. Guitar is plugged straight in to all of my modded amps reducing hiss and maintaining a abundant amount of low end which is lost with Over Drive pedals.

    Factor Shipping.

    Customer Service is second only to Tone.

    Respectfully, David Hopkins.
    a.k.a. NewReligion

    Clone Example:


    Same mod on actual Canadian Marshall
     
    Last edited: Oct 30, 2019
  2. Antmax

    Antmax Well-Known Member

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    You can always buy a badge to stick on it if your that picky. They do white, gold and the more expensive vintage square plate ones are available from third parties.

    If I didn't care for the clone badge, I'd probably take it off, if it looked bad maybe make my own one.
     
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  3. JohnH

    JohnH Well-Known Member

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    I think if I wanted a to have a classic Marshall circuit but with mods, I rather have it through a good quality clone. I think to promote it as a buisness, you'd have to project your own approach to quality and experience, personal attention with endorsements etc (no need to convince us here of that though). I'd suggest to avoid working on any amp that you are not convinced of it's overall quality, since once you mod one for somebody else, you underwrite it at least to some extent.

    I'd never put a Marshall badge on a non-Marshall, but I don't think that's the key question.
     
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  4. John BNY

    John BNY Well-Known Member Premium Member

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    I vote clone.
     
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  5. SkyMonkey

    SkyMonkey Well-Known Member

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    I voted yes because I would prefer Marshall.
    But that being said, some products by Marshall fit my needs less than other makers do.
    I would have preferred a Marshall cab to match the size of my DSL40CR, but Zilla make ones that do, not Marshall.
    So I got a Zilla cab. All ply, my choice of speaker.
    As to amp clones, I have never tried one, so I couldn't make that call. But not all clones are cheaper than Marshall.
    If I need an amp cheaper than a new Marshall, I would probably look for a 2nd hand Marshall.
    Just takes patience and a good eye.
    Does that make me a snob?
    That's how I got the Zilla cab.
     
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  6. DLW

    DLW Active Member

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    I can only give my point of view. I mean no disrespect as I am sure everything you mod is of amazing quality and tone and I think your price for the time to do the mods, knowledge and skill it takes and the overall great tone are fair for the price of $475.

    The problem is that the service for $475 there is so much competition for for that money. New Bugera amps for the same or less. $500 gets a used 100 watt Marshall if you wait for a bargain. $750 gets an great used amp and $1000 to $1200 gets you an amazing lightly used Marshall.

    The used market is flooded right now driving the prices down and there is no end in sight.
    This makes actual amps or half of a amazing amp affordable for the same price.

    You can get a new Ceriatone made about any way you want for a little over a grand.

    As far as the lablel goes I like the Marshall badge it always looks cool but I play thru clones too. Label really does not matter to me more than price and tone. Marshalls just happen to sound good so I like having them.

    If I had a grand and could get a beat up abused heavily used Marshall or a brand new Ceriatone I am taking the clone. Simply for the idea its going to sound about the same and I can drive it for way more trouble free miles.
     
    Last edited: Oct 30, 2019
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  7. NewReligion

    NewReligion Well-Known Member VIP Member

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    Thank you for your opinion but I must disagree comparing a Bugera to a well modded crafted Marshall or Clone with superior components.

    As for prices driving down it has been
    my experience of the complete opposite as inflation has taken hold as the economy climbs there is less desperation to need to sell.

    As for comparing a stock Marshall or Clone to those who seek a modded High Gain British style circuit as any or all mentioned above it exists only as the motivation to create such circuits.

    Thanks for your input.

    Just st my $.02

    David
     
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  8. NewReligion

    NewReligion Well-Known Member VIP Member

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    Thank you all for your input. It is greatly appreciated.

    David
     
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  9. NewReligion

    NewReligion Well-Known Member VIP Member

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    I read through your post again and I think you for your opinion. But in the last 24 months it has been my experience that the $1200 Marshall’s you speak of are usually in bad shape and need additional work before modded.


    I do indeed make an attempt to purchase amps that have already been modded so that I’m not the guy drilling the extra holes in them. I refer to them as rescue amps.

    David
     
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  10. DLW

    DLW Active Member

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    I completely agree with you on the Bugera thing. Of course the quality cannot compare and the tone even when they try to copy is not as good. They are putting the lowest cost parts and generic all the same transformers in their. 100 watt heads.

    What I was trying to say is basically you can get a lot of amp these days for $500 and sometimes a decent used amp for that money making it hard to let go of that money for a mod vs. another amp.

    The average Joe would love to have a high quality mod service done to their amp but they have to weigh that out with what else they can get for that money.

    As far as the economy well there are differing opinions on that. I just know that the market is flooded with used gear and I am not getting as much for what I sell and I am getting great deals on what I buy and I buy often. This has been the best 2 years I have ever seen the used market for a buyer in the last 10 -15 years or so. There is a lot of garbage out there I agree and also a lot of unrealistic sellers that over price and it just clogs up Craigslist, Ebay and Reverb. There are also a lot of great deals out there on good clean well cared for amps. I have bought some and have seen other get some of them. I am finding more sellers of amps, guitars and pedals and pickups that are just more reasonable and more understanding of realistic prices and more sellers not messing around for months over trying to get top dollar and just moving product for great deals.

    I feel what you are doing is just plain awesome. I hope some chime in here to sign on for the mods service. We are getting a little too plain in gear and music with the generic mass production of both lately not to mention the effect of digital. Its an art modding amps and I hope your service takes off and does well.
     
    Last edited: Oct 30, 2019
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  11. NewReligion

    NewReligion Well-Known Member VIP Member

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    I guess I should clarify. When you discuss pricing on Marshall’s that $ category would only fit the DSL and TSL 2000 series and perhaps the JCM 900 series.

    I should’ve clarified right off the bat I’m talking about the original plexi to master volume series up to 1990.

    Regards, David
     
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  12. NewReligion

    NewReligion Well-Known Member VIP Member

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    Well said. There are many great amps.

    My intended goal is to be able to bring what I have to offer at the lowest cost possible without compromising quality.

    Here’s the first Jose I did. And the schematics were given to me straight from Mark Cameron. Though I did make some of my own changes for a little thicker bite.

    Thanks again for the invaluable input as it does matter.

     
    Last edited: Oct 30, 2019
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  13. NewReligion

    NewReligion Well-Known Member VIP Member

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    In summary perhaps I should rephrase my question as

    “Is it worth the time & effort to but a used Marshall Origin @ $500 then add another $400-$500 on top for a professional sounding smooth growling 50 watt Marshall?”

    For example.

    David
     
  14. ampmadscientist

    ampmadscientist Well-Known Member

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    Start the reactor... Free Mars!
    Well ya know the Marshall hardware is better than the clone usually, but costs a lot more.
     
  15. NewReligion

    NewReligion Well-Known Member VIP Member

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    Indeed part of my point. It can be a Crapshoot. The last Clone indeed used inferior wire. Others will use comparable if not superior components but craftsmanship suffers. The later is easy to correct.

    Two of the best sounding Clones were a George Metropoulos 12,000 series with Metro Dagnall copied transformers. The other being from a company named Red Plate. Red Plate was the less than acceptable craftsmanship.

    In the middle of the road is Ceriatone IMO. I have had to pull two of Nik’s “buffered” effect loops. But everything else is on par.

    Here is Nik’s latest offering of the Cameron Atomica. But to be clear, Mark had little to due with these runs as he had little to do with the “Old Bitch”. These models were built by other Master Builders.

    Meet Ceriatone’s “Molecular” = Atomica attempt. $1200 USD - shipping & Duties etc...

     
    Last edited: Oct 30, 2019
  16. NewReligion

    NewReligion Well-Known Member VIP Member

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    In addition Rockitt Retro advertises a 2204 model based on the format of a 1967-68 50 watt model 1987. The only similarity I could confirm was a Laydown PT. It was mixed with CC & CF resistors to which I replaced in addition to replacing the Sozo caps for Mallory 150’s after testing and properly oriented.

    All anode, grid & cathode wire in addition to NFB & Bias Feed was replaced with 18ga pre tinned wire from valve storm at no additional cost. (Hobby & Care).

    It is not my intention to insult anyone or their products. Simply speak the truth IMO as yo my experiences.

    David Hopkins
     
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  17. Solid State

    Solid State Well-Known Member

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    How available is a Clone to me? I got to try out all of my Marshalls in-store. Clones may or may not meet my needs. Once you start spending upwards of $1000 it's hard to make the leap.
     
  18. NewReligion

    NewReligion Well-Known Member VIP Member

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    Agreed. A great Marshall platform currently is going for approximately an additional 50%. Then figure in quality Mod. This is why I ask the question. At $1500 would one prefer a stock 1983 2203 or a hot rodded clone to include a Metro Loop.

    Keep in mind that the Marshall re-issue’s with loops are equipped with a exploding hum balance trim pot and a 47k 10 watt resistor that gets as hot as an EL34 that is mounted to standoff’s on the board right next to the bias trim pot. The function of the 47k 10 watt super hot Fire Proof resistor is to drop VDC down from about 340VDC to 30VDC in order to operate the Marshall Loop. (HOT!)
     
  19. NewReligion

    NewReligion Well-Known Member VIP Member

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    There is a common bypass mod for this exploded Hum Balance pot. I have repaired at least 8 of these explosive anomaly’s lol. (HOT!) Heat is not our friend as that is how energy dissipates.

    Under Victoria Marshall I have witnessed some cool developments and as many disappointments IMO.

    David
     
  20. SkyMonkey

    SkyMonkey Well-Known Member

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    If you are taking the leap out of Marshall territory why go for a vintage clone.
    If I was to go non-Marshall I think I would like to be broadening my tonal palette with something that sounds original to the manufacturer, like a Revv maybe (I wish!).
     

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