Discussion in 'The Cellar' started by Vinsanitizer, Feb 16, 2017.
that was/is part of that magic for me as far as listening to the older bands.
music and art in general is not a sport, making records and playing live shows is not a competition.
an artist is what it is and does what he does in the context of where and when he lives.
like a scientist is son of his time, his knowldge comes form his fathers.
you can't ask if Tolomeo (Ptolemy) would be relevant today. today most of his ideas are proved wrong and he would look like freak like flat earth society guys are.
todays rock music was born in the 50s and every relevant arist since then gave his contribution to build the rock of today.
some bands had explosive carreers because at their time they catched the essence of what rock was and still is and have been able to put this essence into awseome songs and live shows exposing people and other bands to new exciting music, ideas, sounds, attitudes.
deep purple, for example, when led zeppelin I came out, immediatly wanted to play their own version of that music.
they understood an liked the power of those sounds, playing style and visions.
they took that seed and evolved into what deep purple are remeberd for.
one thing to keep in mind is that Page, Iommi & Blackmore were doing studio sessions for years before they took their playing on the live circuit.
When Page formed Led Zeppelin, he had worked from being a studio session player, to playing bass in the Yardbirds. Clapton left, then Beck took over. Jimmy switched to guitar & played dual guitars w/ Jeff. Then, Jeff left & Jimmy took over the band. John Paul Jones was a studio session guy as well, & played w/ Donovan. When Led Zeppelin I came out, JPJ also played on Jeff Beck's album, w/ Rod Stewart & both albums had a recorded version of "You Shook Me" w/ JPJ playing on them. Led Zeppelin was birthed out of the ruins of the Yardbirds & actually started out as the New Yardbirds...
So, the guys in those bands didn't just start out, got a band together & got lucky. They were part of an industry that was developing at the time & it worked out for them.
The question is, if there's a thriving industry that would nurture talent in that fashion today, as there was in the past. Honestly? No...
The only seemingly nurturing industry is the Disney family of actors, dancers, singers & musicians. To get in, you pretty much need to have a stage/pageant mom. One that will surrender her life to make the kid the cash cow idol.
Everything else seems to be either an "inner circle" of friends/musicians or on indie band trying to make it on their own.
I think the great rock bands of the past would have a more difficult time making it today, especially if they were to do it with rock music. There's just too much of pop, hip hop, rap, etc. soaking up the limited attention span of today's generation/market.
I think they'd have a better chance if they were purveying pop, hip hop and rap today, given their obvious musical talent and given the market today.
But if one were to go at a more basic level, I think any band - pop, rock or whatever, and regardless of past, present or future - would depend on a large measure of luck to make it. That's just the way it is, in the music industry and in anything else in life. More often than not, the best in any field are not the most successful in terms of recognition accorded to them and everything else that follows.
When i see elementary kid's at school wearing Ac/Dc, Zep,Black Sabbith, shirts tells me these kids are listening to the music I grew up on because the generic packaged crap the music industry puts out is pure crap and they know it...
Personally I would have to go with no.
Here's why, in today's world there are too many options, too many genres, too much "instant gratification", too many distractions. The first major hurdle is that kids and people in general today don't see music as it used to be seen. Today it's more about graphics and gaming, with smartphones in everyone's pocket the whole world is open to them, not like when you got your music and info from the radio and magazines. People today don't concentrate on 1 thing like music, they have lots of things they can do.
Second, the availability of music now makes it tough for a singular artist to go anywhere. When you can go to YouTube and see everything from major artists to guys in their basement the following tends to be so spread out that no one band has "most" of the people.
Also, if Zep hadn't existed in the 70's the big question would be, who did? I mean one of the reasons they were so big was that they were part of a revolution which changed music. From swing to Elvis to the Beatles and finally to bands like zep. If they weren't part of that they probably wouldn't have been as huge. You also have to think, if they weren't there what type of music would have been made and what would their influences have been? They were famous for their unique sound and approach but they were part of a larger collective. I know that zep was just an example and I am using them as such. This all applies to any other band from the era.
The final thing is this. Rock music is not popular today, not like we hope it is anyway. Turn on the radio, not the classic rock station but the modern one. You won't hear anything resembling rock. The things on the radio are heavily distorted guitars, no solos, singers who sort of growl and whine, it's just not the same. That however is what sells now, and really it's a limited run. Bands that were around 5 years ago are gone now, the next one is being cycled through right now and there is another one in line.
The thing about music is that you have to cater to the buyer. If no one likes you they're not going buy your albums or attend your shows. Music speaks to people on a deeper level, we all know that. Music that makes it huge changes the world, it starts trends, it moves masses but today that's impossible. The sheer fact of it is that people today are just too stupid, too detached to ever be moved by talented musicians. Today's people may be more "educated" but they are not as smart, not as deep, not capable of loosing themselves in something. They only want whatever the latest trendy noise is, in that environment there is no room for talented musicians.
100% correct phil.
I stole that as a sig line. perfectly said.
had this in my head for yrs now but the words never
came to me to describe what I was thinking.
I'm gonna say right time and right place for any band.
You misspelled "but"
Thanks for the recognition.
even put your name with it lol. the words gotta ring like bells to be
a sig I think. or at least funny as hell one.
No, I mean you have "buy" and not "but"
Not being condescending, just letting you know.
I got it. I misspell all the damn time.
use to be great at spelling until I moved here. now I pronounce
everything differently so I spell it like it sounds sometimes.
not that this relates to the buy/but though lol.
You have "loosing" instead of "losing"
MF Grammar Police
Just teasing you Phil
Man, great question Vins... Honestly, I think a lot of the bands that came out of the 70's and 80's (for example) would be identified for being incredible musicians and perhaps credited with making some amazing music. But, I also think they may not get the amount of play nor fame that they achieved back in the day. With the churn and burn mentality of todays music and industry, and the way folks go through music, I just don't know - I think people would love them, and then a minute later be looking for the next song to download on their ipod.
On a sad note, I asked a relatively young guy who just joined our company the other day about his music likes. I asked him about Pearl Jam, and did his generation consider them classic rock. His response - "who is Pearl Jam?".
This is probably the most depressing thing I've read in a long while.
Great artists, who have stood the test of time, have never catered to the buyer. They created music that meant something to them. With that, came great music that bridges the listeners between decades. It doesn't matter if they were born in 1940, or 2140. The musicians soul dictates the level of talent it has.
I'm a ginger, so I have no soul. So I don't have any talent.
And if you were to ask a Rock n' Roller in 1960 if Fats Waller or Count Basie was an influence, you'll have the same chance he/she would say, "who are they?"
I meant in today's market. Used to be that music spoke to someone because they could relate. Now it's just whatever makes your head bob for a minute. Notice in modern music how little "story" there is. It's all about pointless nothing.
The original question was about the bands' ability to be famous today. These days, fame has little to do with an artist soul, it's more about marketability and youtube views.
yeah there does seem to be missing that relative story line phil.
I think with the way social media is today and the ease of self promotion
(to a point) has caused the faster death of groups and changed the whole
music experience in both good and bad ways.
Separate names with a comma.