Noise Suppressor for DSL100H

Discussion in 'The Tone Zone' started by TheOgre, Feb 27, 2020.

  1. TheOgre

    TheOgre Member

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    Hey guys!

    The more I play with the DSL, more I like it! Period! However, we guitarists are a difficult type, and as I hardly ever can crank it (only at gigs, that are scarce in this begin of the year) - or even level up the volume above 1 or 1 and 1/2 at home without wife screaming even louder - , I'm pretty sure I don't heard its "real voice". Recently, I give a try to the Red Channel OD2, and I liked it much more than I could imagine! But, as not always a bed of roses, I'm still in the process of learning and trying with it. An attenuator is on my list of "low-to-mid term" aquisitions, but I'm still looking for something else!

    Well... in Red Channel - OD1 Mode, I'd been having a bit of noise from the preamp (and I'm not counting on the noise coming from my huge board, from which I already tracked the most noisier pedals), but when I switched to Red Channel - OD2 Mode, it gets a bit worse, even with the gain knob turned a bit down (7 at OD1, 6 at OD2)... in bedroom levels I can live with it, but the "hum" is there, and will be definitely worse at gigs levels, of course! However, the things get really noisier when using the pedals, specialy the compressor (a "harsh hum" comes in, but still acceptable) and the treble booster (then comes the "hiss", the "hum" e all their family together).

    Then, comes my question... I'm looking for a device to do the noise reduction in my rig, where I use a booster or I stack a bunch of boosters with low gain and moderate-to-high level into the DSL, in both clean and drive channels! Preferably, something that could be used into the series effects loop of the DSL (4-cable mode or direct), being as neutral/transparent as it could be and with the most natural decay, specialy when using volume dynamics (I tend to use even the Green Channel - Crunch Mode, with some hair, and clean it up with the volume knob quite a bit)!

    It seems that the suppressors that have a internal loop tends to track better, but I never tried one, and here in Brazil it isn't so easy to find different pedals (most tha aren't the mini chinese made, or the Boss NS-2, are second hand). So, would the Decimator G String be the guy, or is there something new in the market?

    Cheers!
     
  2. FracStrat

    FracStrat Well-Known Member

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    Some have had bad luck with the NS-2 ……I have not …… Both of my boards are set up with the NS-2s using the Key ( Sidechain ) to clamp down noise …… It’s important to remember that if the unwanted noise is already after the Output of the Noise Gate ( Any Type ) , the point is mute …… As long as the noise is before the Gate Out , any of them with a Sidechain Trigger are Great !!
     
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  3. MonstersOfTheMidway

    MonstersOfTheMidway Well-Known Member

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    I think it might work for some of your pedals because the Decimator G-String has a built-in loop specially designed for noisy pedals (think overdrive/distortion, compressor, EQ, etc.

    But in your case, the problem will be harder to wrangle for a variety of reasons. Since your signal is passing through so many pedals (you mentioned using a "huge pedal board"), you might need to really look at each one as well as consider the power source you are using for each pedal. Additionally, if the noise is coming from the amplifier's preamp section, you might need to put a noise gate/noise suppressor in the effects loop. I can't say for certain because I'm not in the same room to hear what you hear, but it might be something to examine.

    I've used a variety of noise gate (ng for short) and noise suppressor (ns for short) in pedals as well as those built-into multi-effects systems and rack effects systems. All ns/ng systems have their own unique designs and features, so learning what you need for your situation is important. In my rig, I use two ng/ns systems: the Boss NS-2, and built-in noise through a multi-effects unit. I place NS-2 between guitar and amplifier input; I place multi-effects noise gate in the effects loop. Not all ng/ns units are on all the time since certain channels/modes need it more than others. The ng/ns in the effects loop is the most effective because it is programmable where settings can be saved and recalled for specific channels/modes that use different gain and volume levels.

    In addition to ng/ns, you might look at your cables, valves, and settings to see if you can curtail noise using simpler efforts.

    Good luck with your rig.
     
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  4. TheOgre

    TheOgre Member

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    The idea is to use a pedal that has the "loop", just like de G String or the NS-2... put it in the front of the board, and start the "noise loop" at the board's entry until the EQ at the DSL's FX loop, lefting only the mods, ambience e TC Ditto off of the "noise loop"...

    Hmm... my board indeed has a lot of pedals, but almost everyone has its power coming from isolated power supplies (I use a BBE SupaCharger, a Voodoo Iso5 and a Voodoo Digital, avoiding daisy chains). For cables, I'm using the Lava's Tightrope for the entire board. The boosters, except from the Treble Booster, aren't adding to much noise, and as I stated above, am not using them with to much gain/drive, just turning up the level, so they're putting layers of boost but without adding a lot a noise...

    In the sequence (at amp's input): Korg Pitchblack tuner, custom wah, Stomp Audio Amp treble booster, Ohmless Yara 2 Compressor, Bonamassa Fuzz Face, Dr. Scientist The Elements, FoxRox Octron, Deep Trip Kryptone Fuzz, Ohmless Lorena, VFE Pale Horse v1.5, Favoretti's Yellow Cab Overdrive, VFE Alpha Dog, PaulC Timmy and Mesa Tone Burst... the most noisier is the Amp treble booster, followed (by far) by the Ohmless comp. The fuzzes tend to insert some noise too, but I'm using they just a little, as fuzz is more controlled in the type of sound I'm currently playing. At loop, I have, in sequence: Eventide ModFactor, Eventide TimeFactor, modded Boss EQ, Ohmless Detonator and TC Ditto... but, seen that problem isn't at the loop itself, it comes before it (pedals and preamp). The following pedals I'm using pratically fulltime on: Yara, Lorena, Pale Horse, Timmy and Tone Burst, as well as the TimeFactor... the others, come and go by necessity.

    Could try to change the preamp tubes, as I bought it used (two and a half years of bedroom use from the last owner, one month with me), but the noise coming from the preamp isn't THAT loud...

    P.S.: read the thread about noisy in a JVM410, where you post explaining what you're doing with the NS-2 and the buit-in gate the G-System has! Tricky!
     
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2020
  5. MonstersOfTheMidway

    MonstersOfTheMidway Well-Known Member

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    Hello.
    If you're using the Yara, Lorena, Pale Horse, Timmy and Tone Burst for a majority of your playing time, then it might be worth getting a Decimator G-String or NS-2 and place just those pedals in the loop of either noise gate/noise suppressor. Both G-String and NS-2 have a very good built-in loop, so either should be a good option.

    If you're confident noise from the amp's tubes isn't a significant contributor, then maybe you don't need new tubes-your call.

    For what I do with noise gates/noise suppressors, it isn't really tricky at all.
    1) Guitar --> tuner --> NS-2 --> 410H input.
    2) 410H effects loop "send" --> input of multi-effects --> output of multi-effects --> into 410H effects loop "return".

    The multi-effects built-in noise gate lets me program/save a different threshold and decay level for different channels/modes where I might use different settings for gain and volume. See, the problem with using a noise gate pedal is that if you want to use different gain and level/volume settings, the noise gate pedal settings usually have to change as well, which is not an easy thing to do on the fly on a dark stage. Additionally, it gets to be kinda of a hassle if you have to keep going back to readjust the threshold and/or decay settings on a noise gate. This same problem occurs if a player is constantly "rolling back" the volume on the guitar because the signal level is changing, and with a weaker signal going into the noise gate, the threshold setting on the noise gate might cut off the guitar signal sooner than you want. A programmable noise gate will address all those potential issues better than a noise gate/noise suppressor pedal. Not everyone needs a programmable noise gate, but it's nice to know people have options.

    Good luck with your rig. I'm sure you'll get your rig sounding its best in no time.
     
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  6. TheOgre

    TheOgre Member

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    Well... let's get an update here, as I'm a bit abscent since the last posting!

    Had some troubles at home (unwanted visitors - scorpios), so I needed to stay away for a while for the pest control, and only now have I been able to do some new tests at home.

    I've been able to play with a bit more volume (wife traveling), and perceived somethings that already had read about, but couldn't heard with bedroom volumes: the Lead II (Red Channel), played at lower volumes, was going pretty well, even with gain turned a bit up (let's say 6), but when I turned the volume up to something like 2 (no more 'bedroom volume' when considering it’s a 100W amplifier), it start to become freakin' strange and muddy! So, changed back to my last settings using the Lead I (gain at 8) and voilà... besides its punch and "classic-to-heavy metal" saturation, it's way more articulated, defined and less noisy! Not to mention that the equalization of Lead I (Red Channel) balances much better with the equalization of Crunch (Green Channel) than that sound I heard from Lead II when raising the volume a little!

    Now, still could hear a bit of 'hum' there, but it's WAY lower than the one coming from the other mode (Lead II). And, this way, the 'hum/hiss/whatever' coming from the pedals, although still present, are at a much more acceptable level now... I still think that the use of a good noise suppressor, at least at the loop, would be something to consider and interesting to try, even more when thinking about gigs and recordings, but it isn't like that so necessary in the short term anymore.

    For the tubes, I'm still looking what to buy for the DSL, to keep it as it is now or even improve it. I want to buy a "retube kit", even if it's only to keep it as a reserve at first, since the original tubes still seem to have some "firewood to burn" before going out... but don't know exactly what to do in this case yet!
     
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2020

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