MIDI help plzz

carnada · 10-18-2009, 05:22 AM

hey guys........

so now I have

-powerconditioner
-KORG DTR 1000 tuner
-TC G-Major effects unit
-Line 6 PROpod (preamp/effects...but here im using it as a preamp)

SO how do I connect all this shit???? I have read all the manuals and stuff, but im still really fucking lost. A guy at the music store told me to put the effects unit before than the preamp(always!). But now im reading the manual of the effects unit and it says this "Connect the Output of your preamp to the Input of the G•Major." So im really confuzed. And whe they say to connect the output of your preamp to the input of the g-major....DO they mean that I have to connect the midi out of the preamp, to the midi in on the g-major?

HOT TUBES 70 · 10-18-2009, 05:48 AM

do you have a rack amp , head & cab or combo amp ?
i need to know what amp you are using to be able to give
solid advise .

nice gear so far !!!

carnada · 10-18-2009, 06:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HOT TUBES 70

do you have a rack amp , head & cab or combo amp ?
i need to know what amp you are using to be able to give
solid advise .

nice gear so far !!!

im getting a power amp on monday, and then I will be ready to take my huge rack shit to my band's practice spot and hook it up with my marshall cab!. And right now im just using the headphone line out from the pod, WHICH is actually really good. I mean it does sound as if you were standing in front of a wall of marshalls with JMP-1s

BTW I already have midi cables and a bunch of other cables that I bought just to make sure I have everything

AND also, I have a Roland FC-300 midi foot controller that is sitting there waiting to be used. BUT im so bad at this shit, that I dont even know where to start hooking up the stuff!!!

Kendall124 · 10-18-2009, 08:53 AM

I'll give it a try...

Dear god where to start. Ok, throw all that stuff on Craigslist and buy a head/cab with a couple of floor toys. This will save you countless dollars and many sleepless nights. Be prepared to wake up at 3 in the morning, wanting to re-configure your rack. If you still want to try the rack approach, do this...

Get it all in a rack. Because none of these units creates a lot of heat, order isnt really important but I would go (from top to bottom)

Power conditioner
Tuner
POD
Gmajor

IF you are running mono, I would have the guitar go into the front of the POD.
On the back of the POD, I'd run output left to the left input on the Gmajor and output right to the tuner. Tuners can be tone suckers. This way your guitar signal isn’t affected by the tuner.
Output left on the Gmajor to your power amp. Power amp to speaker (really?)
Plug all units into the power conditioner.

Try to use quality cables. Keep cable lengths as short as possible. Here's a tip, I ran all of the audio lines on one side of the rack and all power lines on the other. This helps to reduce noise potential. Also, keep input/output volumes at half, or 12 o'clock.

Now, let's talk MIDI. (are you sure you don't want the head/cab setup?)
You have 2 choices, do you want the POD to control the Gmajor, or do you want the Gmajor to control the POD. Yes, you have the Roland which will select your patches/effects. I, believe it or not, like the Gmajor to control all my gear. Why? because the Gmajor will not only send/receive midi data but it will also do amp channel switching.
We can discuss programming once everything is up and running.

So give that a try. I'm sure I left out something. Lots of guys here use rack systems. The possibilities are endless. Say bye bye to your bank account. No, seriously, have fun with it. I did.

carnada · 10-18-2009, 01:19 PM

hey, I already have everything in a rack case.

But im wondering where do I connect all the midi cables?? and im really confuzed about what should go first, the pod or the g-major.

Yesterday at 5am in the morning I figured out how to plug my guitar in the tuner and then going to the pod. AND it worked.

tarznamps · 10-18-2009, 01:28 PM

Is the Gmaj an fx and preamp unit? If so, why add a pod into the mix?

Keep in mind you have 2 different cabling schemese to work out - Audio and MIDI.
Suggestions based on what little I know of your system:

MIDI = Foot pedal - G maj - Pod
That is the easy part, programming and storing logically and recall is the hard part.

AUDIO = gtr - tuner - pod - Gmaj - power amp - cab
That is pretty easy

I'm sure you know this, but MANY people do not. MIDI does not carry any audio signal. It's a conrol protocol only.

Wilder Amplification · 10-18-2009, 01:40 PM

First off, what MIDI footcontroller are you using?

I personally prefer (although I despise Behringer products this may be the only one I've ever liked) the Behringer FCB1010 footcontroller. The instructions on it are pretty bland, but I know that controller inside and out and once you have it down it's pretty simple. But the beauty of it is, instead of having to "map" the control functions through each MIDI device, you can map it all through the footcontroller instead, which works much better IMHO and seems to work more "seamless" than mapping through each device.

Basically with MIDI, you have 16 channels. Channels are basically "addresses". When you map through the footcontroller, you assign each device a "channel", and the footcontroller uses the different MIDI channels to talk to each device. For instance, you can assign the POD to MIDI channel 1 whereas the G-Major you can assign it to MIDI channel 2.

On the FCB1010 footcontroller, you can program it so that when you switch presets, the controller can send "preset switch" messages on 5 different channels at 1 time. In the global setting on this controller, I set the "preset switch" functions on MIDI channels 1-5. Now, to send a "preset switch" message to BOTH the POD and the G-Major, you can create a preset in the footcontroller that sends out 2 "preset switch" messages at the same time - 1 on MIDI channel 1 and the other on MIDI channel 2. This will send both messages at the same time, but the POD will only respond to the "preset switch" message on channel 1 and the G-Major will only respond to the one sent on channel 2. This will also allow you to create a preset in the footcontroller that switches only 1 device...for instance if you wanted the same G-Major effects on a different POD preset, you can create a preset in the footcontroller to only send out a "preset switch" message on channel 1 only when you hit a certain footswitch on the footcontroller, and vice versa.

When mapping everything through the MIDI footcontroller, you would hook the footcontroller up to the MIDI IN on one of the devices, then use a short MIDI jumper cable to run from the MIDI THRU port of that device to the MIDI IN of the next device. This way all MIDI messages that come from the footcontroller (instead of message sent by the previous unit) get sent to every device, but each device will only respond to the messages sent on the device's assigned channel while ignoring the ones on a different channel and passing them onto the other units.

Let me know if I can be of any help on this.

jcmjmp · 10-18-2009, 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wilder Amplification

First off, what MIDI footcontroller are you using?

I personally prefer (although I despise Behringer products this may be the only one I've ever liked) the Behringer FCB1010 footcontroller.

The POS behringer is a copy of the Roland product. The Roland is far better. My pers pref would be the Rocktron Midi mate, partially, because its smaller and offers a ot of cool functionality like turning effects on/off within given preset.

As for using midi, read all your instruction manuals. Then, experiment a little and come back for questions.

You might want to visit hugeracksinc.com for better help/support.

carnada · 10-18-2009, 07:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tarznamps

Is the Gmaj an fx and preamp unit? If so, why add a pod into the mix?

Keep in mind you have 2 different cabling schemese to work out - Audio and MIDI.
Suggestions based on what little I know of your system:

MIDI = Foot pedal - G maj - Pod
That is the easy part, programming and storing logically and recall is the hard part.

AUDIO = gtr - tuner - pod - Gmaj - power amp - cab
That is pretty easy

I'm sure you know this, but MANY people do not. MIDI does not carry any audio signal. It's a conrol protocol only.

the g-major is an effects unit. Im using the pod as a preamp

carnada · 10-18-2009, 07:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wilder Amplification

First off, what MIDI footcontroller are you using?

I personally prefer (although I despise Behringer products this may be the only one I've ever liked) the Behringer FCB1010 footcontroller. The instructions on it are pretty bland, but I know that controller inside and out and once you have it down it's pretty simple. But the beauty of it is, instead of having to "map" the control functions through each MIDI device, you can map it all through the footcontroller instead, which works much better IMHO and seems to work more "seamless" than mapping through each device.

Basically with MIDI, you have 16 channels. Channels are basically "addresses". When you map through the footcontroller, you assign each device a "channel", and the footcontroller uses the different MIDI channels to talk to each device. For instance, you can assign the POD to MIDI channel 1 whereas the G-Major you can assign it to MIDI channel 2.

On the FCB1010 footcontroller, you can program it so that when you switch presets, the controller can send "preset switch" messages on 5 different channels at 1 time. In the global setting on this controller, I set the "preset switch" functions on MIDI channels 1-5. Now, to send a "preset switch" message to BOTH the POD and the G-Major, you can create a preset in the footcontroller that sends out 2 "preset switch" messages at the same time - 1 on MIDI channel 1 and the other on MIDI channel 2. This will send both messages at the same time, but the POD will only respond to the "preset switch" message on channel 1 and the G-Major will only respond to the one sent on channel 2. This will also allow you to create a preset in the footcontroller that switches only 1 device...for instance if you wanted the same G-Major effects on a different POD preset, you can create a preset in the footcontroller to only send out a "preset switch" message on channel 1 only when you hit a certain footswitch on the footcontroller, and vice versa.

When mapping everything through the MIDI footcontroller, you would hook the footcontroller up to the MIDI IN on one of the devices, then use a short MIDI jumper cable to run from the MIDI THRU port of that device to the MIDI IN of the next device. This way all MIDI messages that come from the footcontroller (instead of message sent by the previous unit) get sent to every device, but each device will only respond to the messages sent on the device's assigned channel while ignoring the ones on a different channel and passing them onto the other units.

Let me know if I can be of any help on this.

Hey im using a Roland FC-300 midi foot controller.

But the way at the sound thing didnt tell me that I needed other midi cable for the pedal board!he only sold me 2!

HOT TUBES 70 · 10-18-2009, 07:58 PM

i'm sure its been said , but put the gmaj. into the loop of the pod !
i would treat the pod just like any guitar amp (head or combo) by putting
the time based f/x into the f/x loop of the pod . your delays ,reverbs ,chorus
will sound best this way etc.

carnada · 10-18-2009, 08:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HOT TUBES 70

i'm sure its been said , but put the gmaj. into the loop of the pod !
i would treat the pod just like any guitar amp (head or combo) by putting
the time based f/x into the f/x loop of the pod . your delays ,reverbs ,chorus
will sound best this way etc.

But u can still control the g-major from the pedalboard right? even tho its in the loop? Because what I wanna do is be able to switch channels and at the same time change effects on the g-major you know.

tarznamps · 10-18-2009, 08:28 PM

Gmaj in FX loop is a good suggestion.

You need 1 long MIDI cable from FC to pod and a 1' from pod - Gmaj.

Man - this is reminding me why I stopped dealing with rack gear and multi-fx units a long time ago!

carnada · 10-18-2009, 08:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tarznamps

Gmaj in FX loop is a good suggestion.

You need 1 long MIDI cable from FC to pod and a 1' from pod - Gmaj.

Man - this is reminding me why I stopped dealing with rack gear and multi-fx units a long time ago!

isnt it supposed to come back tho? not just going in?

Wilder Amplification · 10-18-2009, 08:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carnada

But u can still control the g-major from the pedalboard right? even tho its in the loop? Because what I wanna do is be able to switch channels and at the same time change effects on the g-major you know.

MIDI doesn't care where things are in the audio signal path. MIDI is a digital control language only and could care less what the audio signal does. It just tells each device what to do as far as preset switching goes.

And the beauty of MIDI is that you can change presets on each device individually without changing a preset on the other, AND you can switch them both at the same time. Again MIDI is its own thing completely independent of the signal path. Think of MIDI as its own "communications network" of sorts.

And yes you'll need a long MIDI cable running from the footcontroller to the first MIDI device, then a short one running from the MIDI THRU of that MIDI device to the MIDI IN of the second device.

Give me some time and I'll download the instruction manual for that footcontroller and see if I can walk you through it.

carnada · 10-18-2009, 11:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wilder Amplification

MIDI doesn't care where things are in the audio signal path. MIDI is a digital control language only and could care less what the audio signal does. It just tells each device what to do as far as preset switching goes.

And the beauty of MIDI is that you can change presets on each device individually without changing a preset on the other, AND you can switch them both at the same time. Again MIDI is its own thing completely independent of the signal path. Think of MIDI as its own "communications network" of sorts.

And yes you'll need a long MIDI cable running from the footcontroller to the first MIDI device, then a short one running from the MIDI THRU of that MIDI device to the MIDI IN of the second device.

Give me some time and I'll download the instruction manual for that footcontroller and see if I can walk you through it.

Thanx man, so in total I need 3 midi cables right? Shouldnt I actually need 6? so its 2 for the pedal board in and out? and then the other 4 for the g major and the preamp? thats what the music dude told me, but I dont think he knew a lot about this.....

BTW I got to connect the G-major effects unit through the loop, and it works well. BUT the only thing that bothered me is that when I plug my headphones to the preamp, I can only hear it through one headphone. But when I didnt have the effects unit plugged in. I could hear my guitar through both of the my headphone speakers.

Wilder Amplification · 10-18-2009, 11:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carnada

Thanx man, so in total I need 3 midi cables right? Shouldnt I actually need 6? so its 2 for the pedal board in and out? and then the other 4 for the g major and the preamp? thats what the music dude told me, but I dont think he knew a lot about this.....

BTW I got to connect the G-major effects unit through the loop, and it works well. BUT the only thing that bothered me is that when I plug my headphones to the preamp, I can only hear it through one headphone. But when I didnt have the effects unit plugged in. I could hear my guitar through both of the my headphone speakers.

That's because you probably didn't have the "RIGHT" side output of the G-Major connected to the RIGHT SIDE RETURN of the FX return. I think you have to have both the left and right outputs from the G-Major plugged into the left and right returns of the POD Pro for both sides of the headphones to work.

Forget everything the music dude at the shop told you. For two devices you only need 2 MIDI cables -

One cable from the MIDI OUT of the controller to the MIDI IN of the POD Pro.

One cable from the MIDI OUT of the POD Pro to the MIDI IN of the G-Major.

Now...from what I've learned about the FC300 controller, the MIDI channel it transmits on is a global setting and it cannot send messages out on different MIDI channels at once like the Behringer unit can. This means that if your FC300 is set to MIDI channel 1, both your POD and G-Major will also have to be set to MIDI channel 1 as well. You will then have to set the POD Pro's MIDI mapping up so that when you switch to say preset 11 on the POD Pro, the POD Pro will tell the G-Major to also switch to preset 11, or which ever preset you want it to tell the G-Major to switch to. More than likely by default these devices are already set up as such and if you wanna take the easy way out, just program your settings into the presets that the POD Pro is already switching the G-Major to for given presets.

HOT TUBES 70 · 10-19-2009, 01:36 AM

should we really confuse him with the " four cable method " !!! LOL !!!

Wilder Amplification · 10-19-2009, 01:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HOT TUBES 70

should we really confuse him with the " four cable method " !!! LOL !!!

Maybe he was trying to do the 4 cable method all along and US standard 4 converts to 6 in metric.

*sarcasm/tongue in cheek*

HOT TUBES 70 · 10-19-2009, 09:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wilder Amplification

Maybe he was trying to do the 4 cable method all along and US standard 4 converts to 6 in metric.

*sarcasm/tongue in cheek*

nice one eh !!!!!! LOL !!!!

jcmjmp · 10-19-2009, 10:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HOT TUBES 70

should we really confuse him with the " four cable method " !!! LOL !!!

There's also phantom power to his pedal controller and the control signals that we haven't touched on yet.

HOT TUBES 70 · 10-19-2009, 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jcmjmp

There's also phantom power to his pedal controller and the control signals that we haven't touched on yet.

man , he's in trouble ......!!! LOL !!!

carnada · 10-19-2009, 05:49 PM

u guyz lozt me.

Wilder Amplification · 10-19-2009, 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carnada

u guyz lozt me.

We were just razzin' ya...all in fun.

Read my original post about the two MIDI cables.

carnada · 10-19-2009, 06:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wilder Amplification

We were just razzin' ya...all in fun.

Read my original post about the two MIDI cables.

I thought it was 3?

a long one from the FC 300 to the G-major IN, and then another one from the G-major OUT to the Line 6 IN right?

Wilder Amplification · 10-19-2009, 06:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carnada

I thought it was 3?

a long one from the FC 300 to the G-major IN, and then another one from the G-major OUT to the Line 6 IN right?

Yep...that's 2 cables.

One between each of the 3 devices.

And read it again...I had to switch the order of hookup because of the way the FC300 works.

FC300--->Line6 MIDI IN

Line 6 MIDI OUT--->G-Major MIDI IN

carnada · 10-19-2009, 06:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wilder Amplification

Yep...that's 2 cables.

One between each of the 3 devices.

And read it again...I had to switch the order of hookup because of the way the FC300 works.

FC300--->Line6 MIDI IN

Line 6 MIDI OUT--->G-Major MIDI IN

haha oh shit you are fucking right thats 2 cables

So I have to go from the pod to the g-major? not from the g-major to the pod right?

Wilder Amplification · 10-19-2009, 07:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carnada

haha oh shit you are fucking right thats 2 cables

So I have to go from the pod to the g-major? not from the g-major to the pod right?

Correct. And make sure the cable from the FC300 is connected to the MIDI OUT on the FC300 and the MIDI IN on the Line 6.

carnada · 10-19-2009, 07:17 PM

I have another question...so how come I was hearing my guitar in only one speaker of my headphone?

Wilder Amplification · 10-19-2009, 07:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carnada

I have another question...so how come I was hearing my guitar in only one speaker of my headphone?

If you only had the left side output from the G-Major hooked to the Left Return of the POD and no hookup on the right return from the right out on the G-Major, you'll only get signal going to the left side. You have to hook both the left and right outs from the G-Major to the left and right returns on the POD to get both headphones to work.

Is that a POD Pro, or a POD XT Pro?

10-18-2009, 05:22 AM	#1 (permalink)
carnada Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: 22 Acacia Avenue Posts: 662	MIDI help plzz hey guys........ so now I have -powerconditioner -KORG DTR 1000 tuner -TC G-Major effects unit -Line 6 PROpod (preamp/effects...but here im using it as a preamp) SO how do I connect all this shit???? I have read all the manuals and stuff, but im still really fucking lost. A guy at the music store told me to put the effects unit before than the preamp(always!). But now im reading the manual of the effects unit and it says this "Connect the Output of your preamp to the Input of the G•Major." So im really confuzed. And whe they say to connect the output of your preamp to the input of the g-major....DO they mean that I have to connect the midi out of the preamp, to the midi in on the g-major?

10-18-2009, 05:48 AM	#2 (permalink)
HOT TUBES 70 Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: SASKATOON Posts: 1,675	Re: MIDI help plzz do you have a rack amp , head & cab or combo amp ? i need to know what amp you are using to be able to give solid advise . nice gear so far !!! __________________ MARSHALL 6100LM MARSHALL 1960A W/-G12H 30's CUSTOM BUILT 2X12 W/-V30's "MARSHALL" - only the best will do !

10-18-2009, 08:53 AM	#4 (permalink)
Kendall124 Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Seattle WA Posts: 240	Re: MIDI help plzz I'll give it a try... Dear god where to start. Ok, throw all that stuff on Craigslist and buy a head/cab with a couple of floor toys. This will save you countless dollars and many sleepless nights. Be prepared to wake up at 3 in the morning, wanting to re-configure your rack. If you still want to try the rack approach, do this... Get it all in a rack. Because none of these units creates a lot of heat, order isnt really important but I would go (from top to bottom) Power conditioner Tuner POD Gmajor IF you are running mono, I would have the guitar go into the front of the POD. On the back of the POD, I'd run output left to the left input on the Gmajor and output right to the tuner. Tuners can be tone suckers. This way your guitar signal isn’t affected by the tuner. Output left on the Gmajor to your power amp. Power amp to speaker (really?) Plug all units into the power conditioner. Try to use quality cables. Keep cable lengths as short as possible. Here's a tip, I ran all of the audio lines on one side of the rack and all power lines on the other. This helps to reduce noise potential. Also, keep input/output volumes at half, or 12 o'clock. Now, let's talk MIDI. (are you sure you don't want the head/cab setup?) You have 2 choices, do you want the POD to control the Gmajor, or do you want the Gmajor to control the POD. Yes, you have the Roland which will select your patches/effects. I, believe it or not, like the Gmajor to control all my gear. Why? because the Gmajor will not only send/receive midi data but it will also do amp channel switching. We can discuss programming once everything is up and running. So give that a try. I'm sure I left out something. Lots of guys here use rack systems. The possibilities are endless. Say bye bye to your bank account. No, seriously, have fun with it. I did. __________________ Make a joyful noise unto the Lord.

10-18-2009, 01:19 PM	#5 (permalink)
carnada Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: 22 Acacia Avenue Posts: 662	Re: MIDI help plzz hey, I already have everything in a rack case. But im wondering where do I connect all the midi cables?? and im really confuzed about what should go first, the pod or the g-major. Yesterday at 5am in the morning I figured out how to plug my guitar in the tuner and then going to the pod. AND it worked.

10-18-2009, 01:28 PM	#6 (permalink)
tarznamps Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Music City, USA Posts: 213	Re: MIDI help plzz Is the Gmaj an fx and preamp unit? If so, why add a pod into the mix? Keep in mind you have 2 different cabling schemese to work out - Audio and MIDI. Suggestions based on what little I know of your system: MIDI = Foot pedal - G maj - Pod That is the easy part, programming and storing logically and recall is the hard part. AUDIO = gtr - tuner - pod - Gmaj - power amp - cab That is pretty easy I'm sure you know this, but MANY people do not. MIDI does not carry any audio signal. It's a conrol protocol only. __________________ Tarz-N-Amps Marshall Heads - JTM 45, Haze 15, JCM 2000 DSL 100, JCM 800 2205, JCM 900 4100, Vintage Modern 2466, 1987x Plexi Marshall Cabs - 1960BX, 1960A, 1960AV, 1965B, 425A, 1936, Haze A&B Marshall Combos - JMP 4140 Club & Country, DSL 401, JTM 615, JCM 900 4501

10-18-2009, 07:58 PM	#11 (permalink)
HOT TUBES 70 Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: SASKATOON Posts: 1,675	Re: MIDI help plzz i'm sure its been said , but put the gmaj. into the loop of the pod ! i would treat the pod just like any guitar amp (head or combo) by putting the time based f/x into the f/x loop of the pod . your delays ,reverbs ,chorus will sound best this way etc. __________________ MARSHALL 6100LM MARSHALL 1960A W/-G12H 30's CUSTOM BUILT 2X12 W/-V30's "MARSHALL" - only the best will do !

10-18-2009, 08:28 PM	#13 (permalink)
tarznamps Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Music City, USA Posts: 213	Re: MIDI help plzz Gmaj in FX loop is a good suggestion. You need 1 long MIDI cable from FC to pod and a 1' from pod - Gmaj. Man - this is reminding me why I stopped dealing with rack gear and multi-fx units a long time ago!

10-19-2009, 01:36 AM	#18 (permalink)
HOT TUBES 70 Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: SASKATOON Posts: 1,675	Re: MIDI help plzz should we really confuse him with the " four cable method " !!! LOL !!! __________________ MARSHALL 6100LM MARSHALL 1960A W/-G12H 30's CUSTOM BUILT 2X12 W/-V30's "MARSHALL" - only the best will do !

10-19-2009, 05:49 PM	#23 (permalink)
carnada Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: 22 Acacia Avenue Posts: 662	Re: MIDI help plzz u guyz lozt me.

10-19-2009, 07:17 PM	#29 (permalink)
carnada Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: 22 Acacia Avenue Posts: 662	Re: MIDI help plzz I have another question...so how come I was hearing my guitar in only one speaker of my headphone?

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