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Unread 08-12-2012, 03:44 PM   #1 (permalink)
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looking into marshall amps....

some may think im nuts but thinking of selling my engl fireball 100 to get into a marshall. I like the marshall tone when boosted with a od pedal but dont really no what road to go down. i had a tsl 100 for a few weeks and from what i remember it did not do it for me. I have owned a tsl 100, a single rec boogie, 5150,randall solid state amps ect . so far my engl is a monster against them. i have herd some jcm 900 clips boosted and it sounded good? what do you guys think ? looking for that black label tone to hatebreed tone . i play alot of metal like killswitch , hatebreed, ozzy, slayer ect. I like fat tones with tons of low end with loads of crunch. so what im asking is what marshall with give me the most brutal full tone?
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Unread 08-12-2012, 04:49 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Re: looking into marshall amps....

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some may think im nuts but thinking of selling my engl fireball 100 to get into a marshall. I like the marshall tone when boosted with a od pedal but dont really no what road to go down. i had a tsl 100 for a few weeks and from what i remember it did not do it for me. I have owned a tsl 100, a single rec boogie, 5150,randall solid state amps ect . so far my engl is a monster against them. i have herd some jcm 900 clips boosted and it sounded good? what do you guys think ? looking for that black label tone to hatebreed tone . i play alot of metal like killswitch , hatebreed, ozzy, slayer ect. I like fat tones with tons of low end with loads of crunch. so what im asking is what marshall with give me the most brutal full tone?
A boosted JCM 800 2203..or the KK 800 model....
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Unread 08-12-2012, 05:42 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Re: looking into marshall amps....

HMM... What you described (especially mentioning KSE) is Mesa territory. But, as far as Marshall goes, I'd say a 2003 (JCM 800, 100w), As Marshalls are really known for their upper mids as opposed to their low end, I'd say put an EQ in front of it as well, so you can really dial in that low-end you're looking for.
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Unread 08-12-2012, 05:48 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Re: looking into marshall amps....

not to impressed with the kk800 seems a bit thin to me. I went threw a lot of amps and ended it with the engl. it nails all heavy stuff but dont have that marshall hatebreed tone. it also killed my mesa also
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Unread 08-12-2012, 05:55 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Re: looking into marshall amps....

I think a 2203 or a a JVM could be what you're looking for bro. Welcome to the forum.
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Unread 08-12-2012, 06:12 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Re: looking into marshall amps....

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not to impressed with the kk800 seems a bit thin to me.
Then it wasn't healthy....probably overbiased....running to cold..
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Unread 08-12-2012, 06:19 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Re: looking into marshall amps....

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Then it wasn't healthy....probably overbiased....running to cold..
I'll second that. The one I played was as fat as Kerry.
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Unread 08-12-2012, 06:23 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Re: looking into marshall amps....

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I'll second that. The one I played was as fat as Kerry.
haaaaa maybee it had old power tubes idk it was at GC. thanks for the welcomes guys.
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Unread 08-12-2012, 06:36 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Re: looking into marshall amps....

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haaaaa maybee it had old power tubes idk it was at GC. thanks for the welcomes guys.
Dude, seriously, a healthy 2203..especially the *right* one, and they do differ...is a force to be reckoned with. If its healthy..the right tubes, a boost up front, will BURY an Engl...

Their simple circuits allow them to do nothing but produce straight forward VOLUME, and punch...
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Unread 08-12-2012, 06:42 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Re: looking into marshall amps....

no one here thinks you're nuts. sell it for a JVM410H and be happy

if not i havce a Framus i'd consider swapping if you want. white tolex Framus Dragon with pro cobra mod.
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Unread 08-12-2012, 06:43 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Re: looking into marshall amps....

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Originally Posted by jd267 View Post
some may think im nuts but thinking of selling my engl fireball 100 to get into a marshall. I like the marshall tone when boosted with a od pedal but dont really no what road to go down. i had a tsl 100 for a few weeks and from what i remember it did not do it for me. I have owned a tsl 100, a single rec boogie, 5150,randall solid state amps ect . so far my engl is a monster against them. i have herd some jcm 900 clips boosted and it sounded good? what do you guys think ? looking for that black label tone to hatebreed tone . i play alot of metal like killswitch , hatebreed, ozzy, slayer ect. I like fat tones with tons of low end with loads of crunch. so what im asking is what marshall with give me the most brutal full tone?
oh and for KSE tone the best amps are Framus cobra and Dragon hence my owning two dragons, one stock and one to cobra specs

some samples of the tones i'm getting are in my sig. right now my track REcertified's the best recording i've gotten so far as i'm new and learning.
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Unread 08-12-2012, 06:49 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Re: looking into marshall amps....

just dont want to regret selling my engl.. it dont need any boost at ALL. but just want to try some thing else i guess
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Unread 08-12-2012, 06:50 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Re: looking into marshall amps....

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Dude, seriously, a healthy 2203..especially the *right* one, and they do differ...is a force to be reckoned with. If its healthy..the right tubes, a boost up front, will BURY an Engl...

Their simple circuits allow them to do nothing but produce straight forward VOLUME, and punch...
you ever play out of a fireball 100? what do you mean by the right one?
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Unread 08-12-2012, 07:17 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Re: looking into marshall amps....

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you ever play out of a fireball 100? what do you mean by the right one?
No, that I will admit, but I have had some experience with one...and they do sound awesome...but their tone, to me anyway, is more convoluted...with big emphasis on the lower frequencies..with tons of gain...

An 800, with its minimal circuit path.. produces less gain, but with incredible mid range frequencies that just CUT through anything..and their loud as hell...wall shaking, concrete floor vibrating (no shit..even the 50w 2204 does)...

What I mean by the *right* one is that unfortunately they do differ. All 800s made in the 1980s sound great, but occasionally you run across one that is just incredible...

An 800 2203 is not going to be quite as versatile as the Engl, but the one thing it does do is BUST ASS better then any! Some of the greatest metal recordings of all time where made with 800s..it is the standard in which all other metal and rock amps are judged.

Another 800 to consider is the 2210. This is a higher gain version of the 2203. Some folks on here prefer this model over the 2203.

All of them though are going to require some kind of decent clean/O.D. boost in the form of a pedal up front to get into the gain regions the Engl can get without a pedal. But, this is where the Marshall really shines..that is by naturally pushing its minimal preamp into overdrive..the voice it produces is difficult to describe with words..However, if I were to use just one word it would be DEFINITION..the tone is utterly clean and intact..but overdriven with killer harmonic distortion...with insane dynamics...especially when the master volume is turned up!
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Unread 08-12-2012, 07:30 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Re: looking into marshall amps....

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No, that I will admit, but I have had some experience with one...and they do sound awesome...but their tone, to me anyway, is more convoluted...with big emphasis on the lower frequencies..with tons of gain...

An 800, with its minimal circuit path.. produces less gain, but with incredible mid range frequencies that just CUT through anything..and their loud as hell...wall shaking, concrete floor vibrating (no shit..even the 50w 2204 does)...

What I mean by the *right* one is that unfortunately they do differ. All 800s made in the 1980s sound great, but occasionally you run across one that is just incredible...

An 800 2203 is not going to be quite as versatile as the Engl, but the one thing it does do is BUST ASS better then any! Some of the greatest metal recordings of all time where made with 800s..it is the standard in which all other metal and rock amps are judged.

Another 800 to consider is the 2210. This is a higher gain version of the 2203. Some folks on here prefer this model over the 2203.

All of them though are going to require some kind of decent clean/O.D. boost in the form of a pedal up front to get into the gain regions the Engl can get without a pedal. But, this is where the Marshall really shines..that is by naturally pushing its minimal preamp into overdrive..the voice it produces is difficult to describe with words..However, if I were to use just one word it would be DEFINITION..the tone is utterly clean and intact..but overdriven with killer harmonic distortion...with insane dynamics...especially when the master volume is turned up!
wish i could try one out with a boost.. got a guy that wants my rig but i dont want to make a mistake
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Unread 08-12-2012, 11:08 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Re: looking into marshall amps....

Jvm410 or 210, IMO. Marshall's gainiest and tightest amp.
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Unread 08-12-2012, 11:12 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Re: looking into marshall amps....

I'd give a JVM410h a try, mine has served me VERY well so far and I also own a JCM800.
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Unread 08-12-2012, 11:22 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Re: looking into marshall amps....

The marshall tone is that low mid crunch with articulation and dynamics that's cuts through the band like butter and doing it with style letting through the musicallity of the instrument.
As a marshall Affectionado for 30 years now i want to suggest to you what i think you are hearing in your head...
a jcm 800...could be either one of the early 80's jcm 2203/4 or a jcm 800 2205/2210.
If you want versatilty and tone try a modern jvm 100 head as mentioned earlier by some of the forum members here also.

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Unread 08-13-2012, 12:53 AM   #19 (permalink)
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Re: looking into marshall amps....

Just got back from jamming in my mates studio and can't hear a thing thanks to my 2203. They are awesome with a sd1 out front and bone crunching with a wylde overdrive for those black label sounds!!!

If your after a loop look into 2205/2210 or JVM. I have owned a 2203, 2210 & JVM410H I preferred 2203 & 2210 over JVM but sold the 2210 because would have cost too much to fix it up - had a lot more gain on tap than the 2203, JVM is awesome but just too much of what I didn't need. Also remember you can get pretty close to a 800 on the JVM, do you need cleans? Do you work the volume controls on your guitar for cleans (800)? or prefer to just have a clean channel (JVM)?
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Unread 08-13-2012, 01:51 AM   #20 (permalink)
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Re: looking into marshall amps....

Framus Draon I'm trading's a high gain SLO lead, High gain 2203 crunch and AC30 style clean. little higher end than the ENGL but i have two. again if you deside you're interested in trading i'd do it. it can get modern and classic metal tones easily. look Framus Up. i have a white tolexed Dragon V5 top.

i'd need some cash or other trade added on but you would be into the amp i can all but promise that. it's ALL in there.
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Unread 08-13-2012, 01:53 AM   #21 (permalink)
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Re: looking into marshall amps....

now mine may not be different inprice now so we'd have to look them up before the deal if you were interested but i would want it to be fair for us both.
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Unread 08-13-2012, 06:06 AM   #22 (permalink)
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Re: looking into marshall amps....

You need to try a JVM 410H. This is the Marshall with the most low end (thanks to that resonance control). Btw, my 2203KK doesn't have as much low end, fresh tubes or not.. and properly biased ... It does cut through the mix better than my other amps and that is sometimes more important when you're playing in a band..Those mids are great!
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Unread 08-13-2012, 11:59 AM   #23 (permalink)
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Re: looking into marshall amps....

One more vote for the JVM of your choice.
Go try one first to make sure.
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Unread 08-13-2012, 09:01 PM   #24 (permalink)
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Re: looking into marshall amps....

Tryed a jvm had to flubby of a base for me got over it quick. Thinking of keeping my engl it's to balls of a amp. For that scooped tone if you no what I mean. I'm looking for the zakk wylde tone. Thinking I need a 2203 or a 2210 with a boost. The dsl 100 sounds awesome with a boost to so do some jcm 900 heads to
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Unread 08-14-2012, 10:48 AM   #25 (permalink)
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Re: looking into marshall amps....

My impression of ENGL Fireball (from those in the market) was that they were very good amps that sounded better than"X", but didn't quite get you there. This made me wonder then why people bothered spending all that $ for "not quite there", but I digress.

The obvious choice as mentioned is the KK. Another route is to buy BOTH a DSL and a JCM 900 (2100 -SLX or MkIII depending on taste). The 2 together are in the ballpark of the one KK and you have classic 2203 w. gain type-voicing and modern as.well.
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Unread 08-15-2012, 04:17 AM   #26 (permalink)
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Re: looking into marshall amps....

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I'm looking for the zakk wylde tone.

2203 boosted with mxr zakk wylde overdrive or sd-1......
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Unread 08-15-2012, 04:32 AM   #27 (permalink)
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Re: looking into marshall amps....

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2203 boosted with mxr zakk wylde overdrive or sd-1......


Thats basically it.
Zakk has used the same stuff for years. Also uses a chorus to get the amp a little 'wet'.

The tone on the Pride And Glory record was incredible.
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Unread 08-15-2012, 07:42 AM   #28 (permalink)
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Re: looking into marshall amps....

You came to the right place to talk Marshalls: people here eat, sleep, and s**t Marshall.

The Engl amps are on-trick-ponys. And if you dont use that one trick all the time, then they are useless to you.

The heaviest player I know does not use Marshall: he uses the Peavey 6505+. But he tunes down to a B and never uses clean tone.

I think there is a Marshall out there for you, and everyone of the amps referred here will work for you - you may have to drive them with a pedal to dial in the heavy you want.
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Unread 08-15-2012, 07:53 AM   #29 (permalink)
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Re: looking into marshall amps....

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2203 boosted with mxr zakk wylde overdrive or sd-1......
Ahhh..you guys...The Zakk Wylde pedal and the SD1 are NOTHING compared to the Fulltone pedals...I know some on here like them..and that is cool...but I would have to estimate that those who like then never have tried a Fulltone OD pedal with their Marshall...as if they did they would NEVER go back to those aforementioned pedals..

A 2203, biased right with vintage tubes, Fulltone pedal...that IS the shit! I love my DSLs..they sound *close*, but a 2203 is in another league mid range wise..with respect to the DSL... The only reason I use the DSL instead is because in a two guitar player band it is AWESOME to have the red channel for a killer lead boost...

But seriously, the ZW pedal imo DOES boost nicely, but its noisy as hell...and the tone is harsher. The SD1 just doesn't have enough boost imo..but the Fulltones, I'm tellin' ya, seems as if it was DESIGNED for Marshall... I love my dual drive OD pedal...and I have tried almost all of them...
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Unread 08-15-2012, 07:58 AM   #30 (permalink)
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Re: looking into marshall amps....

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Originally Posted by jd267 View Post
Tryed a jvm had to flubby of a base for me got over it quick. Thinking of keeping my engl it's to balls of a amp. For that scooped tone if you no what I mean. I'm looking for the zakk wylde tone. Thinking I need a 2203 or a 2210 with a boost. The dsl 100 sounds awesome with a boost to so do some jcm 900 heads to
Yeah dude, if u can, keep the Engl...it has a tone that the Marshall does not...no doubt... BUT if you want that famous Marshall voice only one thing will have it..and that is a MARSHALL...

Old school metal tone nearly demands it..the shit that I love...not much into the scooped stuff..but then I'm starting to get old, yes, I know it, but I am PROUD of my generation's musical heritage!!!
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