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Old 02-25-2009, 03:52 PM   #151 (permalink)
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Re: What The Hell Is Diode Clipping????

Does the AVT series have diode clipping?
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Old 02-25-2009, 04:00 PM   #152 (permalink)
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Re: What The Hell Is Diode Clipping????

So, wouldn't you say that it was the SL-X and not the 2000's that reintroduced the all valve signal path? While I see your point of the 2000's being the first "full" line to re-introduce it, I don't think that the SL-X should have to suffer the fate of ignorance because it bears the JCM900 nomenclature.

Ignorance is used here because those who do not know what the SL-X is, are ignorant to the facts about it. I am in not way making an inference to anyone's intellect.
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Old 02-25-2009, 04:02 PM   #153 (permalink)
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Re: What The Hell Is Diode Clipping????

Quote:
Originally Posted by rockinr0ll View Post
Does the AVT series have diode clipping?
AVT's are ValveState, meaning they combine Solid State and Valve technology.

Valve pre and SS power.
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Old 02-25-2009, 04:32 PM   #154 (permalink)
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Re: What The Hell Is Diode Clipping????

I agree the SL-X is a monster, one would need to yield gross incompetence to make it sound bad.
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Old 02-25-2009, 04:34 PM   #155 (permalink)
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Re: What The Hell Is Diode Clipping????

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Originally Posted by joshuaaewallen View Post
These amps are a continuation of the JCM800 and 900 series, although the controversial diode clipping circuit used in the later 800 and 900 amps has been removed in favor of additional valve gain stages."

What's the skinny on this?
I think the "controversy" is irrelevant.

I know there are dozens of albums that I have loved for years that have diode clipping. The presence of solid state components is not bad, but in my opinion the absence of tubes is.

The reason I am trying to mod my amplifiers's clipping section is because I have done an awful lot to make my tone as good as I can with what I have and if I can squeeze a bit more out of my gear then I will try.

Believe me, if it sounds worse then I will put it back and if someone digs their tone without screwing with the amp then they are better off.
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Old 02-25-2009, 04:45 PM   #156 (permalink)
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Re: What The Hell Is Diode Clipping????

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Originally Posted by Hollowbody View Post
I still don't get the logic here, why are you so curious?

You say you don't understand how someone is able to equate Slash with a JCM800 at the same time point out that he is synonymous with the Jubilee but also cite Slash as having used all these different amps?

None of this is contradictory but it does prove a couple of things.

The obvious is that this amp is only part of his tone.

Also, likely or not if Bluesfella managed to find a great deal on an amp to have modded for a certain tone then he should. Nothing against the Vintage Modern and getting a used one is a good idea but sometimes there could be more options if he keeps his eyes open

We all know Slash identifies with the Jubilee but I wouldn't get tunnel vision. I have no intention of trying to sound like him and I use a Jubilee.
I live the no TV creed which is why I have many amps.

fwiw, no one artist relies on a single amp for his sound, I realize that, heck I hope we all realize this.

Backstage is usually a trailer load of gear all tied in to create their own individual sound.

Case in point, Hetfield is said to have used Mesa IIC's I think it was for the basis of his tone, but take a look at his racks and you'll have other amps that are rarely mentioned in the publications.

Tremonti, another huge Mesa proponent and in his racks are a few Bogners as well as other amps for his live and recording gear.

However, take Slash for example since this is where I was drawn in, check out the majority of his recent demo clips, Guitar Player clips, his public appearances, his shows and there is a consistent theme there.

The Vintage Modern.

I'm a fan but I'm more a fan of a lot of other artists and I bought the VM because it happens to nail VR, GNR amongst a few others tones quite well imo so I didn't get it because of him in fact it took me quite some time and testing to finally get one.

I also bought a 2555 stack back in 87 when they first came out. Why? Because they looked cool. I lived in Anchorage at the time so I didn't exactly have the luxury of trying one out then.

Anyway, regardless of what the Jubilee may be based on when someone asks; 'hey what amps did/does Slash play?' Most don't respond by saying it's the JCM800, anyone who knows anything about his gear will say it's the Jubilee, his sig amp, or the VM.

That's my point.
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Old 02-25-2009, 05:33 PM   #157 (permalink)
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Re: What The Hell Is Diode Clipping????

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hollowbody View Post
I think the "controversy" is irrelevant.

I know there are dozens of albums that I have loved for years that have diode clipping. The presence of solid state components is not bad, but in my opinion the absence of tubes is...
Amen! I have said on numerous occasions that the method one uses to arrive at "their tone" really doesn't matter as long as they are happy with the way they sound that's all that really matters. I just want the technical details as to how, for example, the tone in my amp is achieved. This is useful info when one hears somethings he likes and somethings he doesn't, so that he can get to where he wants to go tone-wise. I say if changing the diodes does the trick for you, the rock on!

Quote:
Originally Posted by jcmjmp View Post
The JCM 800 2210/2205 and the JCM 900 (except the SL-X) all had diodes in the signal path to add more clipping, as did the Silver Jubilee and JCM Slash.

The JCM 2000 series was the first line of amplifiers that re-introduced the all valve signal path with no diode clipping. Bufferring of the effects loop and reverb circuit use solid state devices but these devices are not used for tone shaping purposes.
... That being the case, I am basically trying to find out what is inside my own amp (since I don't have schematics). I have been told by countless people that my TSL122 uses diode clipping on the crunch and lead channels, but wiki seems to contradict that. So which is right?
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Old 02-25-2009, 06:40 PM   #158 (permalink)
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Re: What The Hell Is Diode Clipping????

Steelhorse, +1 on that no T.V. I could go on for hours as to why.

I bought my 2550 for similar reasons and I didn't realize it would be with me for so long.

I see your point on the Slash thing,

I guess I just try to dodge narrow perception. Like when I bought my PRS Spruce Hollobody then found out a month later that the guy from Incubus used one and I had played a few gigs for people who were trying to equate me with him. This stigma gives no room for them to open up to new music because they have a preconception.

That's the trick, isin't it? Not caring about opinions and centering one's self in the music and letting it play through you without being conscience of things that can interrupt the flow. That's why when it comes time to play, not having to worry about the tone or the gear is so important. Same as not having to think of what chords to play, but really knowing the piece so you can play it without thinking. Lack of thinking before a gig is bad. Too much thinking during a gig is just as bad.

Sorry. This still about diodes?
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Old 02-25-2009, 08:12 PM   #159 (permalink)
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Re: What The Hell Is Diode Clipping????

Quote:
Originally Posted by joshuaaewallen View Post
Amen! I have said on numerous occasions that the method one uses to arrive at "their tone" really doesn't matter as long as they are happy with the way they sound that's all that really matters. I just want the technical details as to how, for example, the tone in my amp is achieved. This is useful info when one hears somethings he likes and somethings he doesn't, so that he can get to where he wants to go tone-wise. I say if changing the diodes does the trick for you, the rock on!



... That being the case, I am basically trying to find out what is inside my own amp (since I don't have schematics). I have been told by countless people that my TSL122 uses diode clipping on the crunch and lead channels, but wiki seems to contradict that. So which is right?
The bottom of this page has schematics to download for the TSL122:

Marshall Amps Info & Schematics

also check here for more info:

Marshall Amp Heaven Schematics - JTM-45 JCM-50 JCM-600 JCM-900 JCM-2000 JTM-100 JMP IBS Jubilee Valvestate Bluesbreaker

Hope you find the answers you're looking for.
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Old 02-25-2009, 08:54 PM   #160 (permalink)
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Re: What The Hell Is Diode Clipping????

No TV here either. Not for about 4 years now.
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Old 02-25-2009, 09:08 PM   #161 (permalink)
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Re: What The Hell Is Diode Clipping????

me I mean no tunnel vision, I need my big screen tv though!
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Old 02-25-2009, 11:54 PM   #162 (permalink)
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Re: What The Hell Is Diode Clipping????

Quote:
Originally Posted by steelhorse View Post
Anyway, regardless of what the Jubilee may be based on when someone asks; 'hey what amps did/does Slash play?' Most don't respond by saying it's the JCM800, anyone who knows anything about his gear will say it's the Jubilee, his sig amp, or the VM.

That's my point.
Yeah point taken, and a good one it is. But that's not the nuts and bolts. The technical aspect is represented by what 4 out of 6 immediate unsolicited responses on this thread were when you asked how one equates Slash with a JCM800. And that wasn't what someone asked. In addition to other queries, he asked if he could modify an amp to get a sound similar to slash and the answer could have qualified as an absolute yes

...among other options.

Quote:
Originally Posted by steelhorse View Post
me I mean no tunnel vision, I need my big screen tv though!
In my comment about tunnel vision I was referring to me, just to respectfully clarify.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hollowbody View Post
We all know Slash identifies with the Jubilee but I wouldn't get tunnel vision. I have no intention of trying to sound like him and I use a Jubilee.
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Old 02-26-2009, 12:06 AM   #163 (permalink)
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Re: What The Hell Is Diode Clipping????

Yeah ok I get that, but that's not where I was coming from I don't really care about the 'technical aspect' that just isn't real world imo.

When one asks the question out there most don't go by that level of qualification.

If I were to go into a room full of players and fans on a practical level nearly all of them would equate Slash with the amps other than the 800 plain and simple because they're not looking at it from an depth 'what he used in AFD' point of view.

I know guys who can sound like Slash or whoever with a SS combo but for me after playing for as long as I have trying to replicate someone else is pointless unless you're doing the cover tune thing but that lacks soul and to me, that matter most, but that's me.

To me that is the nuts and bolts, the rest is wiring and geek talk.
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Old 02-26-2009, 12:25 AM   #164 (permalink)
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Re: What The Hell Is Diode Clipping????

That's good enough for me, seriously.

Again I see your point.

Thanks.
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Old 02-26-2009, 12:41 AM   #165 (permalink)
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Re: What The Hell Is Diode Clipping????

Do you play hollows as your moniker seems to imply?

If you do please pm me. I'm interested in the type you play if you actually do. There's a few tunes I'm thinking of using one for and I can get a pretty decent one for a good price.
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Old 02-26-2009, 01:59 AM   #166 (permalink)
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Re: What The Hell Is Diode Clipping????

Yeah. I only have two electrics. One is a Red Epiphone Wildcat and the other is a PRS Mcarty Hollowbody. I don't have any big Gibsons like the 135, yet.

I know they are kinda known as Jazz boxes and I listen to jazz and play a little now and then but I am mostly into blues and rock.

Whenever I pick up a solidbody they're cool, but they just feel like someone else would enjoy playing them more.

imo, Eastwood guitars make decent hollowbody electrics now, some are a little retro for my taste but I played a recent model and I thought it was great for the price. If I knew about them earlier I might have saved the $$ and got another amp or pedals or something.

Rickenbacker have a cool vibe and Ibanez seem to be well made too. Pat Metheney plays an Ibanez hollow body, he should try a Marshall too.

Also dig American made original Gretsch or a D'Aquisto.

Yeah I could go on all day about hollow body guitars.

Last edited by Hollowbody; 02-26-2009 at 02:13 AM. Reason: I edited this a million times while you were trying to read it.
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Old 02-26-2009, 02:16 AM   #167 (permalink)
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Re: What The Hell Is Diode Clipping????

Cool, thanks. I'm thinking of picking one up sometime soon.
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Old 02-26-2009, 02:16 AM   #168 (permalink)
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Re: What The Hell Is Diode Clipping????

Back to the diodes.....

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Old 02-26-2009, 07:52 AM   #169 (permalink)
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Re: What The Hell Is Diode Clipping????

Quote:
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Does the AVT series have diode clipping?
just got a AVT50...was $200 on ebay,,,huge amp...its like a deluxe reverb for $200...thats 1970 pricing..lol...using it at outdoor gigs...huge bass...crunch..dont use crunch too much....but when you think "the money it cost"???...what a deal...
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Old 02-26-2009, 08:12 AM   #170 (permalink)
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Re: What The Hell Is Diode Clipping????

Glad you gotcha something Hippie. Did you get the combo or the head?
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Old 02-26-2009, 10:13 AM   #171 (permalink)
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Re: What The Hell Is Diode Clipping????

combo...i got to be able to move fast...these assholes in bars out here...you gotta be able to grab your amp and run!!!lol
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Old 02-26-2009, 11:56 AM   #172 (permalink)
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Re: What The Hell Is Diode Clipping????

This is frustrating, I should stick to playing.

I did something to my amp while messing with the diodes. I checked everything I know of and can't troubleshoot it, seemed like a simple job. Called my amp tech, he is going to look at it in addition to putting in some new JJ power tubes. I have an o-scope but no bias probe with limited experience in either.

I am slowly learning that a tube amp is similar to a living breathing thing that can't be jacked with like pedals or patchbays or a router mainframe and it's one thing to read about the theory and process and a whole other thing to actually get in there and get results. I thought by now I would at least be finishing up my first 18 watt clone but life has a way of pulling in different directions, never enough time.

No worries, this was all about learning anyway and it wont mess up my playing schedule as of yet. Cool thing is I'll be able to avoid it next time and post the outcome.

Still gratefull for all the feedback I get here.
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Old 02-26-2009, 12:01 PM   #173 (permalink)
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Re: What The Hell Is Diode Clipping????

I'm not good with that stuff either. I pay people to do it for me even if my friends think I'm a lazy bum.
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Old 02-26-2009, 12:07 PM   #174 (permalink)
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Re: What The Hell Is Diode Clipping????

Yeah, I agree. Sometimes it's better to pay and get to play.

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Old 02-26-2009, 10:19 PM   #175 (permalink)
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Re: What The Hell Is Diode Clipping????

Quote:
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Steelhorse, +1 on that no T.V....

...Sorry. This still about diodes?
I didn't have a TV for about 4 years before I got married. It was actually pretty great. That's when I made the most progress in my playing (although I'm still really not very good... But I love it anyway...). It is much harder to make progress now with all the distractions in life.

Quote:
Originally Posted by steelhorse View Post
The bottom of this page has schematics to download for the TSL122:

Marshall Amps Info & Schematics

also check here for more info:

Marshall Amp Heaven Schematics - JTM-45 JCM-50 JCM-600 JCM-900 JCM-2000 JTM-100 JMP IBS Jubilee Valvestate Bluesbreaker

Hope you find the answers you're looking for.
To Hollowbody & Steelhorse... Thanks for all the valuble input you have provided. I appreciate it.

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Old 06-09-2009, 09:35 AM   #176 (permalink)
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Re: What The Hell Is Diode Clipping????

well, I just ended a couple of hours playing my new Les Paul traditional through my JCM900 4100 Dr and can only praise the thing...Amp that is.
Just roll back the gain on channel 2 and crank it up and it sounds killer. Lots of bottom end, squealing highs and consistent punchy mids.
To have the wife even comment on how good it sounded was great as well.
The settings i used were vol 5, pres 2.5, bass 8, mid 5, treb 4 and pre amp on ch2 14.5. with this setting it was excellent. And that's with the original Sovtek 5881 tubes in it.
I have read in other posts that some are good and some bad sounding.....touch wood I 'm pretty sure i got a good one.
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Old 06-11-2009, 12:14 PM   #177 (permalink)
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Re: What The Hell Is Diode Clipping????

The presence control is very useful on that amp. I keep the treble at 1 and use the presence to bring back some treble when playing alone. When rocking with the band, presence goes to zero and the treb gets bumped up to 2.5. I'd also suggest trying the clean channel with maximum pre-gain (for your crunchy chords) and really cranking the gain channel for leads. Scorpions-esque!!!
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Old 06-11-2009, 12:18 PM   #178 (permalink)
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Re: What The Hell Is Diode Clipping????

Me too , i like to use the presence also , works great to fill in the mids !
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Old 06-11-2009, 02:39 PM   #179 (permalink)
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Re: What The Hell Is Diode Clipping????

I thought dimed presence scooped mids???
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Old 10-05-2009, 04:27 PM   #180 (permalink)
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Re: What The Hell Is Diode Clipping????

Great Post Guys. I Really Learned a lot on my New/Old JCM900 4100

100 watt Head. With the Right Cab (I've tryed a Few with this) it Sounds

Frickin Great. Not a lot of Bottom End but Hooked up to a 2X15 cab it Rounds

out good with the Treble up high and a Pedal in the loop.

I was Almost Forced to Sell it but I'm Keeping it.
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