best speakers for metal?

Large_Filter_Cap · 06-01-2010, 09:47 PM

Looking for the best speakers to give me some tight bass with alot of mids too for cutting.

The metal I play would be slayer or metallica like speed metal so the speakers should be tight and articulate (i presume) when palm muting and picking fast.

I found V30's were mushy when palm muting.?? Strange cause I thought these would be great. They were new so perhaps they need to break in more.?

I tried G12L's (from an old Valvestate cab), and these were good, but could use better definition in the bass too.

Any ideas? thx

Ken · 06-01-2010, 10:11 PM

You seem to be flailing a bit. "Lots of mids" is not the typical metal sound. Metallica's recorded tone is super scooped mids.

The G12T-75 speakers are really good metal speakers in general as the have a slight mid scoop to begin with. Since you don't know what you want, I'd start with those and later on you might decide you need more of something else. But they are the "Marshall standard" for a reason.

The amp and guitar you use is a big factor too. I play with lots of mids with my Les Paul but scoop the crap out of my tone with the ESP with EMG pickups. I use G12H 80's which have a flat response and I use the amp to shape the tone more than having the speakers have a bias in frequency response. This gives me more options than the G12T-75's as I don't only play metal.

Ken

MartyStrat54 · 06-01-2010, 10:25 PM

I did a write up in my Anything and Everything About Speakers thread. I've tested a bunch of Eminence speakers and I have already stated for your type of music get the Eminence Black Powder. Tight bass and punchy mids.

My Parts-Express review:

I've done extensive testing of Eminence speakers. The Black Mountains are very expensive. Enter the Black Powder. This speaker is very close to the bottom end of the Black Mountain for a lot less money. If you are into heavy metal and drop tunings, you got to try this speaker. Palm muting is very powerful and tight. Nice articulate speaker. Shout out to my man, Anthony Lucas-Eminence

Another speaker is the Patriot Swamp Thang. Here is a Parts-Express review. (Not mine.)

I also design and build my own 4x12 straight and slant speaker cabs for live and studio performance. My most popular and hands down best sounding cabs are a bit deeper than standard, birch and loaded with Eminence Patriots in the top and swamp thang in the bottom. Hands down they have the most crisp, yet full bodied, sound myself and others have ever heard. They are quickly becoming the first choice in the studio. Typically they are driven by Bugera all tube, Marshall all tube, Crate all tube and Bogen all tube heads. The sound is so amazing it's hard to stop playing through them as power chords hit you like a brick sh!t house and leads cut like a stiletto!

Large_Filter_Cap · 06-01-2010, 10:50 PM

I guess I'm looking for a versatile speaker that can give me many sounds but also handle speed metal. I have been playing a new Mesa Rec 2x12 cab using my lespaul classic with the stock hot pu's. The cab in general is very good but palm mutes are suprisingly mushy, with a loss in focus, or articulation. I attribute this to the v30's... Mabye it the cab body too.? anyways, I have heard this was The metal cabinet. Although great for leads, it leaves me desiring more for tight punchy bass. I don't know if they need to break in some more. Anyways a let down for now.

george76 · 06-02-2010, 02:39 AM

try G12H with bass cones (usually T1281 models). not lead cones (usually T1217 models). there is a big difference. but the bass cones are definetly the ones you want out of the two.

george76 · 06-02-2010, 03:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ken

The G12T-75 speakers are the "Marshall standard" for a reason.

I keep seeing you write this but have to disagree with your logic.

Marshall amps and cabs became 'industry standard', as you put it, long before G12T-75 speakers came along. So in theory nowadays Marshall could put whatever reasonable speakers they like in their cabs and people would still buy them. So long as they sound pretty good and there is a Marshall badge on the front of the cab most people are happy, and Marshall are well aware of that.

For more fussy buyers looking for something different they have higher priced cabinets with different speakers in them.

The G12T-75's are the "marshall standard" because marshall decided to use them as stock speakers, not because buyers decided they like those speakers the best out of everything else on the market.

rockinr0ll · 06-02-2010, 05:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Large_Filter_Cap

Looking for the best speakers to give me some tight bass with alot of mids too for cutting.

The metal I play would be slayer or metallica like speed metal so the speakers should be tight and articulate (i presume) when palm muting and picking fast.

I found V30's were mushy when palm muting.?? Strange cause I thought these would be great. They were new so perhaps they need to break in more.?

I tried G12L's (from an old Valvestate cab), and these were good, but could use better definition in the bass too.

Any ideas? thx

A hate to suggest the Celestion 75's but they might be your bag. I personally like Greenbacks but they sound more vintage rock. Maybe try some Warehouse Veteran 30 as they are suppose to not have the mid hump as the new Celestion. Heritage 65 would also be another choice.

Wilder Amplification · 06-02-2010, 09:53 AM

Not the cheapest speaker in the world and also not the lightest but the ElectroVoice M12L is another favorite amongst metal players.

customwhite · 06-02-2010, 10:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wilder Amplification

Not the cheapest speaker in the world and also not the lightest but the ElectroVoice M12L is another favorite amongst metal players.

EV EVM 12-L Black Label (Zakk Wylde) 8 Ohm, 300 Watt RMS, 100 db (1w1m), 80-7000 Hz, massive low end, Zakk Wylde himself: "The perfect combination of the Gibson LP-style and a Marshall."

300 watt each, OMG...

Wilder Amplification · 06-02-2010, 11:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by customwhite

EV EVM 12-L Black Label (Zakk Wylde) 8 Ohm, 300 Watt RMS, 100 db (1w1m), 80-7000 Hz, massive low end, Zakk Wylde himself: "The perfect combination of the Gibson LP-style and a Marshall."

300 watt each, OMG...

Which just means that a cab of four of them will more than take what any 100 watt head would ever throw at them. Love that 100dB sensitivity rating. Theoretically they'll produce 120dB @ 1 meter distance away @ 100 watts.

customwhite · 06-02-2010, 11:07 AM

I would like to try 4 of the ZW speakers with my JCM800 2203
too bad they cost 300€ each.

IbanezMark · 06-02-2010, 11:10 AM

I have G12H-100's in one cab and G12K-85's in another.
Both speakers are voiced very similarly and sound quite good for metal. They can retain a lot of low end without sounding mushy. My palm muting can shake walls without going to mush.

customwhite · 06-02-2010, 11:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IbanezMark

I have G12H-100's in one cab

Would that be a 1982 cab?
I've got the G12H-80 speakers in two of my cabs.
a 1982B and a 1984A bass cab. and I think they are great.

Large_Filter_Cap · 06-02-2010, 11:38 AM

Does anybody have an opinion about the Mesa rectifier cab itself? Is it contributing to the sponginess of the bass ? Are they shyte for speed metal? Mabye a Mesa Stilletto cab for extra tightness ?

IbanezMark · 06-02-2010, 12:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by customwhite

Would that be a 1982 cab?
I've got the G12H-80 speakers in two of my cabs.
a 1982B and a 1984A bass cab. and I think they are great.

Yeah, the 1982A has the G12H-100's. It's a 1987 model.
The 1982B has the other speakers (installed at some point..)

Both cabs really thump with those speakers

Dr. Rawk · 06-02-2010, 12:50 PM

Oh dude I just sold a new quad of Electro Voice EVM12L Black Label Zakk Wylde Signature Speakers DIRT CHEAP! They ran me $1,100.00 new for the quad. You need to play them devastatingly loud to get any kind of cone movement because they are 300 watts power handling each but if loud is your thing these are effing BRUTAL!!

Otherwise Celestion G12T-75's is where I would be heading.

I also just sold a quad of Marshall Celestion Vintage speakers in my new 1960BV and dropped in a quad of 25 Watt Greenbacks for use with my JVM410h. Ahhh complete tonal Nirvana!!

customwhite · 06-02-2010, 12:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IbanezMark

Yeah, the 1982A has the G12H-100's. It's a 1987 model.
The 1982B has the other speakers (installed at some point..)

Both cabs really thump with those speakers

Cool dude,

There's a few here on the Marshall forum that
really likes the 1982 cabs.

MartyStrat54 · 06-02-2010, 06:35 PM

Another good one is the George Lynch Super V12. 150WRMS at under 10 pounds.

JBL E120's weigh 20 pounds each and are similar to the EV12L which is about 19 pounds.

Ken · 06-03-2010, 07:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by george76

The G12T-75's are the "marshall standard" because marshall decided to use them as stock speakers, not because buyers decided they like those speakers the best out of everything else on the market.

Greenbacks used to be the Marshall standard, back in the day. They suited the older rock/metal styles that the Plexi/S.L.'s were being bought for. For modern metal, which is what most Marshall owners play, the G12T-75 is a well designed speaker with the slight mid scoop. The reason they are the stock speakers is because they are very well suited for it. Marshall would not use a junk speaker for their flagship cabinets.

I don't use them myself so it's not like I have no objectivity because I own them. My advice is well taken though: a metal player who doesn't have some experience with different Celestion models should start with the G12T 75's until they know what else they want.

Ken

Buggs.Crosby · 06-03-2010, 07:55 AM

since i started modding my head i have been using a standard 1960 cab....before i got that cab i was using a 1960av....for my needs (hard rock to metal) the 75's are better
the vintage 30's cant handle all the low end i have....and with the mods i have done i'm not missing the mid punch of the v30......but i am also thinking about building a theile quad cab with the EV 12l's....it's gonna be a lot of work and probably weight about 150lbs...but after hearing the Boogie 1x12 theile i am sold.....the projection of that cab was insane

Wycked Lester · 06-03-2010, 10:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wilder amplification

not the cheapest speaker in the world and also not the lightest but the electrovoice m12l is another favorite amongst metal players.

these speakers are the shit !!!!!!!!!!

***crossroadsnyc*** · 06-03-2010, 11:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by george76

try G12H with bass cones (usually T1281 models). not lead cones (usually T1217 models). there is a big difference. but the bass cones are definetly the ones you want out of the two.

+1

rykus · 06-03-2010, 11:59 AM

i like black back 70's celestions, more trebley and cutting than the older warmer green backs and every now and then they pop up cheap, i had a mesa 4x12 and it had a super pronounciated bass and you could hear it push air kinda a whoop whoop bottom end sound that i found overly loud but it coloured the sound of the amp less, where as the black backs add something and sound like their in some sorta melt down.... but i play pretty sludge doom style of metal so its great! i've always heard the 65's where top notch too but haven't tried em yet.

Ken · 06-03-2010, 02:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by customwhite

Cool dude,

There's a few here on the Marshall forum that
really likes the 1982 cabs.

The few, the proud, the 1982 cabinet owners!

Of course, the cabinets are just period 1960 series as far as I know. It's the speakers that make them good. You can't go wrong with a 1982 though because all of them have top quality speakers no matter which of about 8 different ones your model has.

Ken

andylaughs · 06-03-2010, 02:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wilder Amplification

Which just means that a cab of four of them will more than take what any 100 watt head would ever throw at them. Love that 100dB sensitivity rating. Theoretically they'll produce 120dB @ 1 meter distance away @ 100 watts.

You could also try Eminence Delta 12A speakers. These are comparable to Zach's signature speakers, rated at 400 watts and go for 80 bucks at Amazon. If I didn't already have a shit ton of cabs and speakers, I'd go the same route.

MartyStrat54 · 07-21-2010, 07:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by andylaughs

You could also try Eminence Delta 12A speakers. These are comparable to Zach's signature speakers, rated at 400 watts and go for 80 bucks at Amazon.

Do you mean the Delta Pro 12A's? They are only $80 bucks on Amazon? Is this a new or used speaker? Everyone that I have bought it from wants around 109 dollars. Of course, Parts Express and some other retailers ship the order for free. This saves a lot since I usually buy six to eight pairs at a time.

MM54 · 07-21-2010, 07:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MartyStrat54

...since I usually buy six to eight pairs at a time.

Holy shit, I bet they cringe at the shipping distribution center when they see your address

DPTONE5 · 07-21-2010, 09:57 PM

For the style of music you're playing Large Filter Cap, have you considered the GT12-75 speakers (mid-scooped) and pushing your amp with a mid-heavy pedal, like a TS-808 reissue. A lot of metal guys are using the TS-808 and GT12-75's for the same reasons you mentioned (good metal tone, tight low end when palm muting and the added mid's to cut through the mix and articulation).

Hope this helps!

Large_Filter_Cap · 07-21-2010, 10:34 PM

As generic sounding the G12T-75s are, they sound much much better for palm muted metal than V30's. In my 2x12 I may experiment with one V and one 75, and see how that goes.

kebek · 07-22-2010, 10:18 AM

i own 1982A and 1982B all loaded with G12H-100... love them...
note that a 1960 and a 1982 is NOT the same... 1982 wood is a lot heavier...
i owned 1960A and 1960B all loaded with G12T-75 and they were too metal for my style...
I agree G12T-75 is best for metal... palm mute and speed picking...

06-01-2010, 09:47 PM	#1 (permalink)
Large_Filter_Cap Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: OT_Canada Posts: 187	best speakers for metal? Looking for the best speakers to give me some tight bass with alot of mids too for cutting. The metal I play would be slayer or metallica like speed metal so the speakers should be tight and articulate (i presume) when palm muting and picking fast. I found V30's were mushy when palm muting.?? Strange cause I thought these would be great. They were new so perhaps they need to break in more.? I tried G12L's (from an old Valvestate cab), and these were good, but could use better definition in the bass too. Any ideas? thx

06-01-2010, 10:11 PM	#2 (permalink)
Ken Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Arlington Heights, IL Posts: 6,242	Re: best speakers for metal? You seem to be flailing a bit. "Lots of mids" is not the typical metal sound. Metallica's recorded tone is super scooped mids. The G12T-75 speakers are really good metal speakers in general as the have a slight mid scoop to begin with. Since you don't know what you want, I'd start with those and later on you might decide you need more of something else. But they are the "Marshall standard" for a reason. The amp and guitar you use is a big factor too. I play with lots of mids with my Les Paul but scoop the crap out of my tone with the ESP with EMG pickups. I use G12H 80's which have a flat response and I use the amp to shape the tone more than having the speakers have a bias in frequency response. This gives me more options than the G12T-75's as I don't only play metal. Ken __________________ 1999 Marshall DSL 50 Music Man 65 Reverb late 1970's (?) Late 1970's (?) Fender Champ Marshall battery amp 1980 Model 1982A 4x12 cabinet G12H-80's 444 cones 1983 Model 1982B 4x12 cabinet G12-80's 444 cones PRO 4x12 from the 1970's Woodson 2x12 1976 Les Paul Standard Epiphone Les Paul knockoff ESP Lawsuit Explorer 1979 Chiquita Travel Guitar 1995 Taylor 310

06-01-2010, 10:25 PM	#3 (permalink)
MartyStrat54 Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Now in Muskogee, by Tulsa Posts: 18,236	Re: best speakers for metal? I did a write up in my Anything and Everything About Speakers thread. I've tested a bunch of Eminence speakers and I have already stated for your type of music get the Eminence Black Powder. Tight bass and punchy mids. My Parts-Express review: I've done extensive testing of Eminence speakers. The Black Mountains are very expensive. Enter the Black Powder. This speaker is very close to the bottom end of the Black Mountain for a lot less money. If you are into heavy metal and drop tunings, you got to try this speaker. Palm muting is very powerful and tight. Nice articulate speaker. Shout out to my man, Anthony Lucas-Eminence Another speaker is the Patriot Swamp Thang. Here is a Parts-Express review. (Not mine.) I also design and build my own 4x12 straight and slant speaker cabs for live and studio performance. My most popular and hands down best sounding cabs are a bit deeper than standard, birch and loaded with Eminence Patriots in the top and swamp thang in the bottom. Hands down they have the most crisp, yet full bodied, sound myself and others have ever heard. They are quickly becoming the first choice in the studio. Typically they are driven by Bugera all tube, Marshall all tube, Crate all tube and Bogen all tube heads. The sound is so amazing it's hard to stop playing through them as power chords hit you like a brick sh!t house and leads cut like a stiletto! __________________ MARTY MARTIMUS MAXIMUS ONLINE TUBES AND OTHER STUFFHyperlink Wilder modded JCM 2204 (Sold my JMP to Joe.). Many other amps. Strats and Explorer are my main guitars.

06-01-2010, 10:50 PM	#4 (permalink)
Large_Filter_Cap Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: OT_Canada Posts: 187	Re: best speakers for metal? I guess I'm looking for a versatile speaker that can give me many sounds but also handle speed metal. I have been playing a new Mesa Rec 2x12 cab using my lespaul classic with the stock hot pu's. The cab in general is very good but palm mutes are suprisingly mushy, with a loss in focus, or articulation. I attribute this to the v30's... Mabye it the cab body too.? anyways, I have heard this was The metal cabinet. Although great for leads, it leaves me desiring more for tight punchy bass. I don't know if they need to break in some more. Anyways a let down for now.

06-02-2010, 02:39 AM	#5 (permalink)
george76 Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 731	Re: best speakers for metal? try G12H with bass cones (usually T1281 models). not lead cones (usually T1217 models). there is a big difference. but the bass cones are definetly the ones you want out of the two.

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06-02-2010, 09:53 AM	#8 (permalink)
Wilder Amplification Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Fresno, CA Posts: 6,165	Re: best speakers for metal? Not the cheapest speaker in the world and also not the lightest but the ElectroVoice M12L is another favorite amongst metal players. __________________ Jon Wilder Wilder Amplification - The official home of the 80s cock of the walk "Schwank" http://www.wilderamps.com http://www.facebook.com/wilderamps

06-02-2010, 11:07 AM	#11 (permalink)
customwhite Senior Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Helvete Posts: 742	Re: best speakers for metal? I would like to try 4 of the ZW speakers with my JCM800 2203 too bad they cost 300€ each. __________________ Always Satan The Fallen God There are always those who in their search for God Seem to find Satan instead

06-02-2010, 11:10 AM	#12 (permalink)
IbanezMark Senior Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Ottawa, ON Posts: 7,076	Re: best speakers for metal? I have G12H-100's in one cab and G12K-85's in another. Both speakers are voiced very similarly and sound quite good for metal. They can retain a lot of low end without sounding mushy. My palm muting can shake walls without going to mush. __________________ Life is hard. It's even harder if you're stupid.

06-02-2010, 11:38 AM	#14 (permalink)
Large_Filter_Cap Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: OT_Canada Posts: 187	Re: best speakers for metal? Does anybody have an opinion about the Mesa rectifier cab itself? Is it contributing to the sponginess of the bass ? Are they shyte for speed metal? Mabye a Mesa Stilletto cab for extra tightness ?

06-02-2010, 12:50 PM	#16 (permalink)
Dr. Rawk Junior Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Posts: 25	Re: best speakers for metal? Oh dude I just sold a new quad of Electro Voice EVM12L Black Label Zakk Wylde Signature Speakers DIRT CHEAP! They ran me $1,100.00 new for the quad. You need to play them devastatingly loud to get any kind of cone movement because they are 300 watts power handling each but if loud is your thing these are effing BRUTAL!! Otherwise Celestion G12T-75's is where I would be heading. I also just sold a quad of Marshall Celestion Vintage speakers in my new 1960BV and dropped in a quad of 25 Watt Greenbacks for use with my JVM410h. Ahhh complete tonal Nirvana!!

06-02-2010, 06:35 PM	#18 (permalink)
MartyStrat54 Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Now in Muskogee, by Tulsa Posts: 18,236	Re: best speakers for metal? Another good one is the George Lynch Super V12. 150WRMS at under 10 pounds. JBL E120's weigh 20 pounds each and are similar to the EV12L which is about 19 pounds. __________________ MARTY MARTIMUS MAXIMUS ONLINE TUBES AND OTHER STUFFHyperlink Wilder modded JCM 2204 (Sold my JMP to Joe.). Many other amps. Strats and Explorer are my main guitars.

06-03-2010, 07:55 AM	#20 (permalink)
Buggs.Crosby Banned Join Date: May 2009 Location: S.Jersey Posts: 6,363	Re: best speakers for metal? since i started modding my head i have been using a standard 1960 cab....before i got that cab i was using a 1960av....for my needs (hard rock to metal) the 75's are better the vintage 30's cant handle all the low end i have....and with the mods i have done i'm not missing the mid punch of the v30......but i am also thinking about building a theile quad cab with the EV 12l's....it's gonna be a lot of work and probably weight about 150lbs...but after hearing the Boogie 1x12 theile i am sold.....the projection of that cab was insane

06-03-2010, 11:59 AM	#23 (permalink)
rykus Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 126	Re: best speakers for metal? i like black back 70's celestions, more trebley and cutting than the older warmer green backs and every now and then they pop up cheap, i had a mesa 4x12 and it had a super pronounciated bass and you could hear it push air kinda a whoop whoop bottom end sound that i found overly loud but it coloured the sound of the amp less, where as the black backs add something and sound like their in some sorta melt down.... but i play pretty sludge doom style of metal so its great! i've always heard the 65's where top notch too but haven't tried em yet.

07-21-2010, 09:57 PM	#28 (permalink)
DPTONE5 Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Pennsylvania Posts: 1,948	Re: best speakers for metal? For the style of music you're playing Large Filter Cap, have you considered the GT12-75 speakers (mid-scooped) and pushing your amp with a mid-heavy pedal, like a TS-808 reissue. A lot of metal guys are using the TS-808 and GT12-75's for the same reasons you mentioned (good metal tone, tight low end when palm muting and the added mid's to cut through the mix and articulation). Hope this helps! __________________ Marshall Amps - 1987XL, JMP 2204, JCM 800 2203X, 2555 Jubilee, JCM 800 2210, 6100 Cabinets - 1960BX, 1960B JCM 900 Guitars - PRS CU 24, 91' Gibson LP Classic, Fender Clapton Strat, Jackson SL-1, Taylor 410-CE, Fender Highway One P Bass Pedal Board - Boss Tuner, Fulltone Fulldrive II Mosfet, ReIssue Ibanez TS-808, Ernie Ball Volume Pedal to amp in. Loop - Boss Chorus, MXR Carbon Copy, Lee Jackson Mr. Springgy, Boss GE-7 EQ (Monte Allums Mod)

07-21-2010, 10:34 PM	#29 (permalink)
Large_Filter_Cap Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: OT_Canada Posts: 187	Re: best speakers for metal? As generic sounding the G12T-75s are, they sound much much better for palm muted metal than V30's. In my 2x12 I may experiment with one V and one 75, and see how that goes.

07-22-2010, 10:18 AM	#30 (permalink)
kebek Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 695	Re: best speakers for metal? i own 1982A and 1982B all loaded with G12H-100... love them... note that a 1960 and a 1982 is NOT the same... 1982 wood is a lot heavier... i owned 1960A and 1960B all loaded with G12T-75 and they were too metal for my style... I agree G12T-75 is best for metal... palm mute and speed picking... __________________

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